EP92 Nick Fletcher | From Shooting Dirt Bikes to Wild Photo Festivals

[00:00:00] Speaker A: Sa. [00:00:24] Speaker B: Good morning, everybody and welcome to the Camera Life podcast. It's Thursday, 26 June. Financial year in Australia is almost over. We're at episode 92 of the camera Life podcast, proudly brought to you by the team at Lucky Straps out of Bendigo, Victoria, makers of fine handmade leather camera straps. Speaking of which. G' day, Justin. G' day, Jim. [00:00:49] Speaker A: Good morning, Greg. [00:00:50] Speaker B: How are you, lads? [00:00:51] Speaker A: We're great, how are you? I'm just answering for Jim. We're great, yeah. [00:00:55] Speaker C: We saw each other this morning. You can answer. [00:00:57] Speaker A: That's true, we did, yeah. We've already caught up. I've had coffee, morning's going well. [00:01:03] Speaker B: Good to hear. Looking very colorful today and. And for those of you watching long at home, I finally got my lighting sorted out, cleaned up a bit, got some display things happening here and. But enough about me. This is the Camera Life podcast and Thursday morning, we're always joined by guests and today we are joined by photography royalty, as far as I'm concerned. Nick Fletcher, welcome to the show. [00:01:26] Speaker D: Thanks, Greg. Great to be here. [00:01:28] Speaker A: Good, good. [00:01:29] Speaker B: So we've got a bit to cover. Given your age, we've got a fair bit to cover off in terms of your history, but Nick, I just give us a quick grab who you are, what do you do. [00:01:41] Speaker D: Well, I would have thought you could tell from the lights. I'm an influencer. [00:01:46] Speaker B: Nice. [00:01:47] Speaker D: Now I'm a fraud. I'm. It's. Given who you've had on before. I'm not a full time photographer. I love photography but I'm probably most famous for founding and running along with Matt Bright Festival of Photography. I'm a huge and passionate photographer. I sit on the board of a big photographic gallery and I personally shoot a whole range of things, but principally sport and principally two wheel sport. So that's sort of me. [00:02:15] Speaker B: Nice. All right, well, welcome to the show. Good to have you on board. You want to jump to some morning comments there, Justin? [00:02:21] Speaker A: Yeah, the chat's going crazy. I want to just say good morning to everyone. Good morning, Philip Johnson. Good morning. John Pickett. Rodney Nicholson. Now, this is a new name, I think, Dave Clutterbuck. I'm a huge fan of Nick's. This should be awesome. I'm sure it will be. Is that a familiar name to unique Dave Clutterbuck? [00:02:40] Speaker D: No, I've not come across Dave. Dave, glad you're a fan. [00:02:44] Speaker A: Good to have you here, Dave. Where are you watching from, Dave? Yeah, another Dave, David Moscaro. Good afternoon from the Bay Area. Always good to see David. Craig Murphy says Good morning. Philip Johnson adds in a good morning to Nick as well. Not just, not just the chat that he said before rx a good photography. Good morning. And Kev Morse, good morning. From Margate, Tasmania. Where's that? Yeah, I don't even know where that is. [00:03:09] Speaker B: Let us know what part of Tassie you're in, Kev. We got a lot of, a lot of folks from Tasmania. [00:03:13] Speaker A: Yeah, I don't know what it is. [00:03:15] Speaker B: I think we need to do a. [00:03:16] Speaker A: Bit of a road trip maybe there's just nothing to do down there. So they watch YouTube, it's winter, so they're just curled up next to a fire watching live streams. [00:03:25] Speaker B: Hey, it ain't much better in Victoria. [00:03:27] Speaker A: Yeah, it was cold this morning. Very chilly. [00:03:30] Speaker B: Yep, yep. [00:03:33] Speaker A: Well, should we dig in? [00:03:35] Speaker B: Let's dig in. Nick, prepare for a grilling. So, you know, as you mentioned, I, I call. I consider you photography royalty because of my experience of BEP last year, which is probably one of the most prominent photography experiences I've ever had. I think it was my first time. Justin and I went down as team Lucky Straps and we got up to some shenanigans and some Tom Foolery and some belly who. But we want to, we want to learn more about you than just the court that you hold over bright once a year. So let's roll it back a little bit and talk about perhaps some of your early inspirations into photography. You know, were your parents artistic? Were they business minded people? Were they. Did you have influences? Not social media influences, but mentors that supported you along the, you know, in your early journey. So just let us know what sort of started the ball rolling to become a photographer. [00:04:32] Speaker D: And before I do that, I should say I, I was enormously grateful for your sort of coverage of Beef Up. You, you got it in a way many people don't. You sort of got the joke and it was enormously generous and it was a lot of fun and it sort of caught the magic that I feel. But sometimes not everyone sees. You know, sometimes people will go, well, this is all a bit amateur or this is all a bit crazy, but you, you got it and you sort of really immersed yourself in it and I love that. And it's quite a special sort of podcast and series of articles you wrote. [00:05:06] Speaker B: For any shenanigans, mate, any time. [00:05:09] Speaker A: We just had the best time. [00:05:10] Speaker D: I'm sure we're going to talk about Beef up, but we should talk about your part in BE next year or this year. [00:05:15] Speaker A: Oh, it's gonna be a fun one. [00:05:18] Speaker D: So anyway, I think as far as I'm concerned I've always had a camera and as far as I can remember borrowing my dad's camera or you know, having a little pocket camera and I had this sort of fairly cool sort of youth. I was, I was doing sport, I was climbing, I was doing triathlon, I was, you know, my parents lived in Africa for a while and then through my twenties I was sort of, you know, climbing bigger and bigger things. So you're going to these. And I joined the military. So you're going to these sort of cool places with these really wild people and you just wanted a camera to sort of record what you were doing. And my dad was always quite keen on photography so I just steal his. In fact I dropped his, his camera off Nellion, the sort of the proper peak of Mount Kenya, which he was enormously appreciative of. [00:06:16] Speaker B: Well, if you're going to drop a camera I guess you got to go big or go home, don't you? [00:06:19] Speaker D: Yeah, he was amazing. It sort of, you know, we were 5, 200 meters and this thing just sort of cartwheel all the way down the cliff and throughout the film and then the lens came off and I watched it go all the way down. So I always done photography and I think probably in my sort of, it was probably coming to Australia where I bought like a D70 or D80, I can't remember what it was one of the really early Nikon digitals and I was starting to go to places to take photographs rather than go to places to do cool things and then happen to photograph them. But the, the thing that sort of really twisted it for me is I had a good mate called Rupert Shaw who's actually the reason we have a festival, but that's a, it's a longer story. And he had always ridden motorbikes and I'd ridden motorbikes in the army. You know, like they have these crappy old Enfields that you sort of ride and parachute out of planes with. And he, he was a big motorbike rider and I was hanging out with him. He said you should get a bike. We go riding. So I bought a motorbike and we started doing these trips and, and Rupert is an absolute world class, first class idiot. Utter, utter muppet. So he, he's so funny to hang out with because underprepared, just everything goes wrong around him. I started writing these articles and I thought, I wrote this sort of long, long article about us. We, we'd ridden across the Simpson Desert and so I wrote this article about this and I sent it off to Adventure Rider magazine. I've still got it. I brought it because it's so funny and I've given it the title Crossing the Simpson with a. Crossing the Simpson with a Buffoon. So it was this chance to write these articles about Rupert and I read a whole series. You know, it probably went on for a couple of years and me just writing about these idiots. But I was photographing all of the. The rides and one thing led to another and then I got asked to go on a, you know, a proper, grown up, organized trip and photograph and write about it. And that sort of really snowballed. And in the background I was photographing triathlon and running and all sorts of, um. But essentially that provided the foundation for my photography because I was getting it published. I was getting brought on and paid to do these rides and I was getting more and more passionate about it. So that, that was sort of the background. And then, you know, I just threw a whole lot of weird connections. I ended up on the board of the Museum of Australian Photography. So I got exposed to this sort of amazing artistic side of photography. The. But I think sort of many photographers kind of underestimate how useful it is to sort of understand that and then be came along. And that's been just a huge part of my life and Matt's life. So that's. That's a very short story. And all the time I've had a. Had a day job the whole time. [00:09:23] Speaker A: So through all the work that I've seen your website and stuff, you've always had a day job and just done this stuff in between. Where it fits in. [00:09:30] Speaker D: Yeah, paste my holidays. That's it. [00:09:32] Speaker A: That's crazy. [00:09:34] Speaker B: I just want to go back a little bit. You talked about that moment, and to quote Oprah Winfrey, it's an aha moment where, you know, we. We start taking cameras with us because we want to document our travels or our journeys or our experiences. And then you. You cross that boundary where all of a sudden it's you. You want to do photography and the, the trip or the experience facilitates that. You know, it reverses that role in your life. And I think, you know, I think a lot of guests that we've spoken to have talked about that, how they, you know, they always had a camera around or they, you know, always use important shoots and they took them on travels. But then all of a sudden they realized that actually they were wanting to go on travels to do photography. You know, I really love that moment. In, in people's journeys where it flips for them, you know, and all of a sudden they realize, actually hang on, I'm onto something here. Now another question I had for you there, Nick. You talked about jumping out of airplanes with a motorbike. Did you actually ever do that? [00:10:33] Speaker D: Yeah, I was, I was in the, I had just had this blessed military career. I, I was an engineer, an engineer officer and I sort of finished Sandhurst and we, for whatever reason there was like classic military sort of sequencing issue between my professional training to be a Royal Engineer and the Sanders. It was like a six month gap. So they said, what do you want to do? And I said well, I want to go and play with the parachute engineers, which normally you wouldn't get to do until your second tour. So I went down to stay with them and they turned up and had this sort of absolutely useless sort of 21 year old turning up who they couldn't do anything with and they said. [00:11:08] Speaker A: Well, what do you want to do? [00:11:09] Speaker D: And I said well, I'm going to go and get qualified to be a para. So I went off and did parachute selection and then parachute training and came back after three months and they still had three months. And they said well, what do you want to do now? And I said well, can you train me as a diver? So I went off to be an engineer diver and sort of, I turned up at my first unit having been a para and a diver, something normally take you 10 years in the engineers to do. And, and of course when I finished my training they, they went, we better send you back to the parachute squadron. So I got to go and serve with them in my first, my first tour. So yeah, yeah, we jumped out of planes with all sorts of things strapped, I should say. We didn't actually sit on the motorbikes. They came down strapped to a palace. [00:11:55] Speaker B: I was thinking Mission Impossible style, like. [00:11:57] Speaker D: Ride it out on one wheel. [00:12:00] Speaker A: I was to make an a get AI to make a new thumbnail for this podcast of you just like, yeah, monoing out of a massive airplane. [00:12:09] Speaker D: Yeah, but we, we, it was an amazing time. We were part of what's still the biggest parachute jump since the Second World War. You know, we had people jumping out with chainsaw strapped to them, all sorts. [00:12:23] Speaker A: Super fun, crazy, crazy man. [00:12:27] Speaker B: Maybe not, maybe not everyone's cup of tea, but yeah, jumping out of a plane with a chainsaw, what could go wrong? And you said that you went on a, you, you, you actually had to tour as an active service person. [00:12:39] Speaker D: Well, I was a professional War Dodger. [00:12:42] Speaker A: So. [00:12:42] Speaker B: Yes, yeah, Bone spurs. I hear that's a. Yeah, that's right. [00:12:47] Speaker D: Trump. No, I was a bit of, I sat between kind of the, A lot of people I served with had fought in the Falklands War, but that had been 10 years before me. And then I left, like, two months after September 11, so I had kind of the more active peacekeeping staff in Bosnia and Kosova and Cyprus and places like that. Um, but I principally got shot at by my own people rather than the enemy. [00:13:16] Speaker B: Right, And a question about that. So at any of those times, were you, were you taking shots? Did you have a cheeky camera in your, in your pack? [00:13:26] Speaker D: Oh, yeah, yeah. No, no, absolutely. I, I, I would parachute with a camera down my smock. So you kind of think you're going out at 800ft, so you've only got, like, I know, 15 seconds before you hit the ground. So you've got to whip this thing out, get a shot, get it down, and then get your container away and land. [00:13:41] Speaker A: What sort of camera would that have been for that? [00:13:43] Speaker D: Oh, it was a little, we call them squattymatics. Little point and shoot. I mean, you weren't bringing out your. [00:13:48] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:13:49] Speaker D: 70 to 202.8 and full frame camera. Why not? [00:13:54] Speaker B: Yeah. Can everyone just smile as you're floating down? Olson has also joined the chat. Good morning, Sam. Sam also served in the Australian military. She said here. Military parachuting. I don't know how we're talking about this on a photography podcast, but the round parachute on, on landing equals the same forces as jumping out of a third story window. Imagine doing that with a chainsaw and a camera. [00:14:15] Speaker A: Sam, drunk or sober? [00:14:19] Speaker D: Yeah, well, we had, we had, we did have on, on that U.S. jump, the, the big one we had. Someone had a double malfunction, so went in without a parachute from 800ft and survived. Oh, and I broke my back parachuting. So there's, there's, there's certainly. We could talk about that for years. [00:14:38] Speaker A: Oh, gosh. [00:14:38] Speaker B: Yep. [00:14:40] Speaker A: Does that give you any trouble now, the, the back, the back stuff. It still does. Oh, damn. Does that change, like how. What sort of gear you like to shoot with and what you carry? Have you tried. Had to. You haven't worried about trying to lighten off equipment or anything like that? [00:14:54] Speaker D: No. [00:14:54] Speaker B: I was going to say you had a pretty big pack on for the, the beef up day out. [00:14:59] Speaker D: Oh, did I? Can't remember what I have. [00:15:00] Speaker B: Yeah, you had a big red pack on, but you were carrying the little, your Fujifilm. I Can't remember what you're carrying. Was it an X E3? [00:15:07] Speaker D: It was probably an X Pro 3. [00:15:08] Speaker B: Okay. [00:15:09] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, that's right, it was. [00:15:10] Speaker B: Sorry, had to get in the Fujifilm mention early guys. [00:15:13] Speaker A: Yeah, so just, just to really, just to set the scene for the rest of the podcast in case anyone wants to log off. Do you only shoot Fujifilm or do you shoot any other brands? [00:15:21] Speaker D: No, no, no, no. I, I, I, I don't, I, I, I'm Nikon. Love Nikon. So all my, all my professional works, Nick, on it's what I, you know, 99 of the shots in a year will be on a Nikon. I, I've really enjoyed the little Fujis for a whole lot. I travel a lot with work and, and often I just don't want to bring a big camera so I'll bring a, a Fuji. And I'm actually in this weird position where the only Fuji I've got is kind of a, an old compact sort of medium format Fuji. So I've as you know I've just been conned into buying a gfx, but that all I've got at the moment is this which is like 40 years old. [00:16:08] Speaker A: Hang on, so you don't have the GFX yet? [00:16:11] Speaker D: No, no. [00:16:13] Speaker A: Ah, well, I gotta cross off 15 of the questions I've got written down to us. [00:16:17] Speaker D: I have used it. [00:16:19] Speaker A: How long did you get to use it for? [00:16:23] Speaker D: A couple hours. [00:16:24] Speaker A: Okay. Yeah, so not, yeah, I'll have to cross off most of my questions. [00:16:27] Speaker D: You know the, you know the story about how I ended up with a Fuji? [00:16:32] Speaker A: No, tell us. [00:16:33] Speaker B: Yeah, tell us that one. [00:16:35] Speaker D: Well I, when I go up to Sydney, which is pretty much every week, I stay in the Mantra Hotel which is to Bond street and it's exactly opposite the Fuji shop. So every time I walk into work I literally walk past that know Fuji specialist Fuji only sort of brand shop. And like just before the, the beef op event I'd sort of headed out sort of late in the day. I done a call, 10 o' clock, I'm looking through the window of Fuji and someone grabs me from behind. Do you guys know Matt went? [00:17:11] Speaker A: I don't think so, no. [00:17:12] Speaker D: So Matt's a Fuji ref. He was a guy who was dressed. [00:17:15] Speaker B: Oh yeah, he was a beef up. [00:17:16] Speaker A: As the ref with the, with the. [00:17:18] Speaker B: Hair looks a bit like, I mean. [00:17:20] Speaker D: He'S kind of got the build and look of you know, giant haystacks from sort of 80s wrestling. So I don't know who this is. He's grabbed Me from behind. He's got me in a net choke. And he drags me into the Fuji store, like. And he's really squeezing. I know who it is. And then I start graying out and, like, it all goes black. He's choked me out and I wake up and, like, completely confused, sitting outside the Fuji shop. And I found my wallet on my thing and a receipt for gfx. [00:17:57] Speaker B: Oh, that Terrible, terrible. [00:17:59] Speaker D: And that's. Yeah, that's what my wife understands happened. [00:18:06] Speaker B: Oh, dear. [00:18:08] Speaker A: Right. Maybe you should help people with their stories of coming up with how they purchase cameras. I think that could be something. People would probably pay for that service. [00:18:21] Speaker B: Yeah, I think we could do a whole show just on people's excuses. [00:18:24] Speaker A: Yep. Why I just had to buy that Leica M11. It's the only thing. It's the only thing that would get me. Yeah, that. That 3D pop. Oh, dear. So you've. You've bought it, but you haven't. You haven't got it yet. You're still waiting. [00:18:39] Speaker D: No, I haven't. I haven't. Matt's. Matt's not told me when it's turning up. I also bought a X100VI as well, so. [00:18:46] Speaker B: Gosh, why not? [00:18:48] Speaker A: Why not? Will you. Do you. Yeah. Do you see yourself only keeping one out of the two of those? Are they kind of be like. [00:18:56] Speaker D: Well, Matt asked that question. Probably not, actually. No. No, I probably. I'll probably use them both in different ways. [00:19:03] Speaker A: You do know that the GFX100RF doesn't have IBIs, right? So all your. All your photos will be blurry. [00:19:11] Speaker D: Matt is a total ass on that. He's just the wrongest man alive on that. The guy's not got a clue. [00:19:16] Speaker B: We're talking about Matt Crummonds, aren't we? Yeah, yeah, yeah. We. We had a discussion about it. [00:19:23] Speaker D: This is a case of sort of. Matt needs a torque wrench and they've made a screwdriver. And he's like, well, it doesn't work as a torque wrench. Well, no, because it's a freaking screwdriver, you muppet. I mean, his whole thing about. Well, it doesn't have a. Doesn't have 100 mil LE. A fixed lens camera, you ass. I mean, God. [00:19:47] Speaker A: Yeah, perfect. That's the clip I wanted done. [00:19:53] Speaker B: Nice. [00:19:56] Speaker A: That's funny. A few comments coming in, including this one from Craig Murphy. Matt does not know tools. Paul Henderson says. Morning, all. What have I missed? You missed stuff. You'll have to listen and then you'll have to rewind later cam. Blake photography tuned in at the right time. Nick paying off on Matt. Can we move on to Tom next? [00:20:24] Speaker B: All in good time, Cam. All in good time. [00:20:26] Speaker A: We'll save that for later. Sam says that's the only way I'd move from Nikon to Fuji, having to get choked out. And David, David Mascara from San Francisco says love this guy. David is a die hard Nikon shooter. I think he's got 13 or 14 Nikons. Everything from David's in San Francisco. Yeah, yeah. He's a regular, regular listener from David. [00:20:48] Speaker D: Have you been to the festival with Bright? [00:20:51] Speaker A: The Bright Festival, right. [00:20:52] Speaker D: Yeah. [00:20:54] Speaker A: Yeah. And come to be fop, if you're. [00:20:57] Speaker D: Prepared to cut fly to Australia, I will find you a ticket. [00:21:01] Speaker A: He would love it. He would love it. Yeah, he's a. Mainly a street shooter, but yeah, it was one of it. We've actually got a weird kind of crew of Californians that tune into from a time zone. [00:21:13] Speaker D: It's whatever it is. Like 4 o' clock in the afternoon. [00:21:15] Speaker A: Yeah, but. But nowhere north of that. You know, we haven't had anyone from Canada or anything. It's always just California, like SoCal up to San Francisco and then that's about it. It's. Yeah, it's very cool. Tim Syama says morning all. Just a quick, quick cheeky drop in whilst at the office. Good job. Skip work. And finally, Kev Morse clarified. Margate is 22 km south of Hobart on the can't pronounce it channel. Anyone? Anyone know how to pronounce that? [00:21:48] Speaker B: Dientricasu. [00:21:50] Speaker A: Oh, fancy. Very fancy. [00:21:53] Speaker C: No one knows if that's correct, but no one's going to try. [00:21:57] Speaker B: People believe you. [00:21:59] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:21:59] Speaker D: Has anyone given you money yet? Have you told them? Have you told them how to give you money? [00:22:02] Speaker A: No one's given us money yet. It's mainly just you and our other friends that give us money. [00:22:07] Speaker D: We'll just run through how you do it because I found it quite hard to find. [00:22:10] Speaker A: It's. I'm pretty sure. Isn't there like a dollar sign next to the thing where you. Where you submit your comment? I actually can't remember. [00:22:17] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:22:18] Speaker A: If anyone can. [00:22:19] Speaker B: Yelena made a donation last week and it came out of Justin's credit card. [00:22:26] Speaker A: We got the notification for the comment and then I got the notification on my phone for the 1.99 or whatever it was and then you lose. Here we go. [00:22:34] Speaker C: You lose the DMC on the way through. [00:22:36] Speaker A: The drunk wedding photographer. He's also a. Also David and also from California, but from LA. David mascara says it's beer, 30 o' clock. And Dave Clutterbuck says Matt Crummons is an absolute clown. Nick is so right. [00:22:52] Speaker D: Nice work, Dave. [00:22:53] Speaker B: Nice work, Dave. [00:22:55] Speaker A: Ah, I didn't realize. Drunk wedding photographer. I didn't realize you were Nick on all the way. I know you had your film cameras, but you've also got N75, F5, F6. I didn't know you had an F6 as well. The D200 and the D700. Yep. Nick on man. [00:23:10] Speaker B: Yep. [00:23:11] Speaker A: Well, that's. Hey, that's probably a good segue. David wants to know, does Nick shoot film at all? [00:23:16] Speaker D: Yeah, this is a film camera, which I don't take a lot of pictures on, but I do enjoy nipping out. [00:23:21] Speaker A: Is that the 6 by 9 1? Is that the medium format? [00:23:26] Speaker D: Yeah, I think they call it the Texas Leica. [00:23:28] Speaker A: Texas Liker. Do you want to sell? [00:23:29] Speaker B: Yeah, we talked about that last week. [00:23:31] Speaker A: Do you want to sell it to fund your GFX100? [00:23:34] Speaker D: We know you can borrow it if you want it. [00:23:36] Speaker A: Well, that'd be amazing. That probably a cheaper way to satisfy my. My film. We had a film panel show the other night and afterwards I spent 400 on film. So I'm. I'm gonna give it a little bit of a nudge over the next month or two. [00:23:54] Speaker B: Nice. I just gave my film. [00:23:56] Speaker A: Did you? [00:23:57] Speaker B: Yeah, I had a whole. Whole. But yeah, well, I gave it to Xe, who is a friend of mine and he's a street shooter and he was in the chat the other night when we're talking about film. He's only a young kid. He's actually studying industrial design, which is what I studied at university, very, very long time ago. But yeah, I had a big bag of film in the fridge and I wasn't using it. And he shoots a lot of film, so. And I'm sorry, Justin, there was a roll of Cinestill in that bag that I gave away. [00:24:22] Speaker A: It's sold out everywhere. And I want to be a hipster and I've never had two of them. I assume it will make. Make my photos look like cinema because it's called C still. [00:24:35] Speaker B: What's your favorite film, Nick? Oh, yeah, Just had a dropping in that Fuji. [00:24:41] Speaker D: I'm true. What I've got in there, it's a. It's. It's a. It's film rather than transparency. I'll have to go. I can't genuinely can't remember what I've got in there at the moment. Okay, that's all right. Have I Got it on the back. [00:24:53] Speaker A: No, don't open it. This is a good question and I want to ask you about. So not a question. RXA Photography says I love my Z9. Are you shooting, what are you shooting with for your professional work? [00:25:07] Speaker D: I've got, I've got a Z8 and a Z9 and I. Yeah, I think they're, they're super. I mean look, I don't think with Sony or Canon or any of them you can go that wrong with the sort of the, the high end cameras. But it works really, really well. And interestingly a couple of the things that Nikon do around auto capture work really well for bmx. So. [00:25:30] Speaker A: What do you mean auto capture? [00:25:31] Speaker D: Well, they've got. It's going to sound like a nick on Advertorial. Julie Kimpton. You're very welcome, Jim. I thought you would have shot Canon. Do you two not both shoot Canon? No, I'm. [00:25:43] Speaker C: I'm exclusively Nikon. [00:25:46] Speaker A: Let me explain. [00:25:47] Speaker D: Some sort of color grading nightmare for Justin. [00:25:49] Speaker A: Absolutely. I don't do it though. I don't touch any of Jim's stuff anymore. So let me explain to you how this unfolded. Jim was a professional photojournalist shooting Nikon because they gave him all of his own, all of the stuff from the Advertiser but he also had, he had 1D 701 lens. But all of the other stuff he got from, you know the cool room at the Benny Advertiser when they used to have all the cool equipment, D3s and D4s and all the fun stuff and lots of lenses. I was shooting Canon and I started my wedding photography business and then Jim started shooting with me and we were shooting Canon Nikon and it was a pain in the ass because I was editing everything at that stage. Then we ended up sort of going more into business together and Jim wanted to get out of his day job and become a self employed photographer. So at that point, Canon. I was waiting patiently for the Canon 5D Mark IV. [00:26:52] Speaker B: Hang on mate, sorry you're going all garbled. There's something wrong with the Internet. [00:26:56] Speaker A: Oh really? [00:26:57] Speaker B: Your speech is coming through wobbly. [00:27:00] Speaker D: They're fine with me. [00:27:01] Speaker A: Yeah, it might be you. [00:27:02] Speaker B: Maybe it's me. [00:27:03] Speaker A: Oh well, you don't need it. [00:27:05] Speaker D: I thought he was trying to get us back to Fuji. [00:27:06] Speaker A: Yeah, I thought he was about to try. Hey, hey, hey. Stop talking about Canon. Anyway, so I was shooting canon but the 5D Mark III was lagging behind in the. Like I was, I was editing Jim's photos and my Photos and I'm like, the Nikon sensors are better right now. Definitely. Like you could lift the shadows and you didn't get all these weird purple fringing colors. And in there. The skin tones were better on Canon, but everything else was better on Nikon. Anyway, they didn't release the 5D Mark IV for ages. And so I just decided to make the jump and go full Nikon so that we were shooting the same stuff. We could share flash kits and lenses and whatever and we all had the same thing. So I swapped to Nikon and figured out how to turn the lenses the other way and turn the dials the other way and all that sort of stuff. And then fast forward to when was it? Like 2020. I had played around with the Nikon Z6 a bit and was considering the jumps. Mirrorless shooting, you know, D850 and Z6 side by side was a pain in the ass. It's like going from like, I, I either wanted to shoot mirrorless or, or dslr. And it was time to make the jump to mirrorless. And when you're making the jump to mirrorless, it's almost, it's probably the best time to consider a system change because yeah, you know, you're essentially looking at whole new lenses once you want to finish using adapters and stuff like that. So I was considering all my options, including Sony. And then Canon approached us to make the, the limited edition. [00:28:40] Speaker D: Oh, I remember that. [00:28:41] Speaker A: Yeah, for the R5 release. And I was like, well, if you guys do this with us, I will 100% change all of my stuff to Canon and get the new R5. And I did that and never looked back. So that's why, that's why we shoot different systems and it's fun because Canon's better than Nikon. So there's that. [00:29:03] Speaker C: Definitely not. [00:29:05] Speaker D: So actually you, you might, I don't know, I don't know whether there's any use with mountain biking, but this auto capture is really good, particularly for BMX racing. I, I often put remote cameras out mainly because I keep getting hit by bikes. But you can sort of sit on a low tripod right next to the track. And I used to do it with a Pocket Wizard. But the problem with bimx racing is you might have three races going at the same time. It's like a 42nd race. [00:29:37] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:29:38] Speaker D: So you're on another place on the track taking photos and it's over here and just. I do not have the coordination to be sort of watching out of my side eye when they're Going through there and pressing it and taking photos over here. So just missing all the good crashes. So Nikon on. I think it was initially on the Z8 and then they brought it to the Z9. Had this auto capture feature where you can set it, start taking photos when it sees something in the frame and you can set it for a distance and a size and a speed. It's not perfect, but if you're prepared to. If you're prepared to just have a shitload of shots to go through, it's quite good. And I, I don't rely on the focus on it, so I pre focus it. But. [00:30:23] Speaker A: Okay, yeah, so it would track if. But, but you would try. [00:30:28] Speaker D: I've generally got it on a wide angle lens with riders coming towards me and like Even on a Z8, Z9, a BMX at, you know, 15 mil, it's just not going to perfectly track it, particularly the last little bit when it's right close, which is where you want the shot. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Anyway, I do that. The, the real challenge with it is I'll always put it somewhere where there's going to be an accident. And if there is an accident, of course, then all the first aid is coming and this camera's just, oh, 20 frames a second. [00:31:01] Speaker A: Just constant with all the movement. Oh, that you're running over there like. [00:31:06] Speaker D: No, yeah, that's exactly what I'm doing. I've got. I've got a two teraby card I put in it because I'll come back with 50,000 shots. [00:31:14] Speaker A: Oh, that's funny. [00:31:17] Speaker B: That's pretty clever. That's a pretty clever feature. It's like a trail cam almost. [00:31:20] Speaker D: Yeah, yeah, it is, it is. I mean I've got some magic. I've got a really brilliant shot. I don't know if it's on the website or not of these two riders hit each other and one starts going over the bars and it's coming straight at the camera and in fact the front wheel hits the camera and you just see this sort of rider like this in the. So it's. It's allowed me to get a number of. [00:31:45] Speaker A: Would that be on the Internet anywhere? [00:31:48] Speaker D: It'll. It might be on my website. I'm not sure. [00:31:52] Speaker A: Just. I want to see it, but that's. [00:31:53] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:31:54] Speaker C: Just trying to find Justin's searching Z8. Do you prefer the Z8 or the Z9? [00:32:01] Speaker D: Well, the Z. If I'm climbing mountaineering then Z8 every time is much, much smaller. I think for sport, the Z9 is slightly better for a Couple of reasons. On really hot days, even with a really Fast card, the Z8 will eventually overheat even just shooting stills. And this form factor of the Z9 is nicer, particularly with kind of a big lens where you want to, if you want to flip it into portraits. Yeah, but I mean like I, I, if anyone asked me which to buy, I'd say buy the Z8. I mean why would you pay another thousand dollars for exactly the same camera? [00:32:36] Speaker C: Yeah, that's fair enough because I think I found it. I haven't even looked at the speeds of the Z9. [00:32:44] Speaker D: Is, is, it'll be under the, it'll be under the, under the bicycle section, I reckon. [00:32:49] Speaker C: Justin, are they comparable speed wise? [00:32:53] Speaker D: Oh, they're exactly the same camera. Yeah. There you go. So the next shot after that is the, is the front wheel of the bike hitting the camera. [00:33:01] Speaker A: Oh wow, that's awesome. And so that was fully. So that camera was just stationed there and you trusted it to, to capture but you pre focused and it's obviously pretty deep depth of field as well anyway because. [00:33:12] Speaker D: Yeah, and I've actually got another, I was had a long lens down the straight there and I've got another shot where you can see the camera sort of cartwheeling away after getting hit. [00:33:21] Speaker A: Oh, that's great. Be sure to include that when you list it for sale on Facebook Marketplace. Be sure to include that shot of it. [00:33:30] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:33:32] Speaker D: Like I've had the cameras hit three or four times, never had one damaged. Yeah, like it's incredible what they'll take. [00:33:39] Speaker A: Yeah. That is one thing about Nikon and it's, it's a pro and a con. The, compared to Canon, the build quality, I don't think functionally I've, you know, abused the Canons pretty hard and there's nothing wrong with the build quality. They're super solid. But the Nikon feels a little bit more solid and it's a bit chunkier of a camera. [00:34:02] Speaker D: It's a couple hundred grams heavier for like. [00:34:05] Speaker A: And that's the downside is that lightweight wise, like the R5 Mark II is a very sort of. It's a bit slimmer and it's a little bit lighter and just as capable in my opinion as a Z8. [00:34:17] Speaker D: Yeah, Nikon weren't very. I wrote a review on the. I mean I love the Z9 but I think the two comments they didn't like was the one about, well, if Canon can make a camera, you know, 550 grams or whatever it is, why can't you? And they really didn't like the comment that congratulations on making a battery door you can't. Or a car door you can't open accidentally or deliberately for that matter. [00:34:43] Speaker A: Right. Where is this, where's this review? You reviewed it? [00:34:46] Speaker D: Oh, I think it's actually on the, on, on that. I don't know whether I took it off, but it was on that, that website somewhere. [00:34:52] Speaker A: Okay, so you, is that something you do a bit of? [00:34:54] Speaker D: No, I do it like I, I did it on the D6 and some others that I'd sort of got over time just because I, you know, I, I often find that I can't find the reviews that answer the questions I want to know. So I thought, well, I'll write one. There'll be someone like me out there wanting to find out, yeah, what this is like for sport. And some other things. [00:35:14] Speaker A: I think like. [00:35:14] Speaker C: A real lack of real world reviews. It's, it's technically like technical reviews and stuff like that, but sometimes, but not, you know, how does it go shooting, mountain biking or something like that? That's. [00:35:29] Speaker D: Yeah, that's right. And also people don't sort of acknowledge that the compromises and why those compromises have been made to me. Like the Z9 at the time may not be true with the new Sony's and new Canons, but at the time they sort of every kind of engineering decision they made, I went, yeah, I'd have made that. That's a perfect compromise. So, you know, between kind of resolution and dynamic range and just the frame rate. And it was, I just went, this is exactly for the way I'm going to use this camera. This is perfect. But people don't acknowledge that that's a series of compromises. I mean people like Matt Crummins around the GFX100RF, like, you just got to think about, well, how's this camera get used? Do we want ultimate dynamic range or do we want frame rate? What do we want? You know. [00:36:13] Speaker A: Yeah, it's, it's, it's a hundred percent sure. It's all, Everything's a compromise to price everything. How, how durable do you want the body to be versus how light do you want the body to be? Both and at a reasonable price, cannot be, you know, you can't have the lightest and most durable body for the cheapest price. You got to pick some things. So it's, it's, yeah, it's a great way to look at it. And then if you, if as a reviewer you look at it from that perspective of like, are these compromises for me, a Good thing or a bad thing? I think that's a great way to review a camera, even if it's in just some niche areas. And I reckon we could do with more of that like real world use case reviews. But you don't have to do everything. You don't have to write out all the specs and compare it to this and compare it to that. Just, just your opinion on what the cameras like to use. And that's why forums and Reddit and stuff like that have still been so popular and will continue to be popular because people actually want to read just some random person's opinion on what it was like to shoot kids soccer or whatever. They don't always want to see the highly polished first day of release review from someone who's a professional reviewer, even though they do a very good job of that as a separate kind of thing. [00:37:34] Speaker B: Yeah, and I think long form or you know, long use reviews where people have had it for three, six months and then they go back and, and go, well, these are, these are the things that over time have started to piss me off and these are the things that I love. Or you know, because when you pull anything out of a box when it's shiny and new, you're excited about it. It's just, that's why unboxing videos are so bloody popular with kids. You know, like it's, there's that adrenaline, there's that dopamine hit of getting something new and you feel good about it because it's shiny and it's new and it's, you know, and then over time you need to then sort of. How does it go in these different genres? How did it actually, you know, that's. [00:38:15] Speaker A: Actually, that's a great question, nick, with your Z8 or Z9 either is there anything that you're thinking, geez, I hope on the new one that they release, I want this. Or are you just completely satisfied with those? Currently. [00:38:34] Speaker D: There'S some, some things I don't think they'll release, but I think at some point they will do on cameras. And I'm sort of mixed about whether they're going to do it, whether they should do it or not. But. And that would be. I've always wondered why they haven't done. If you think about how IBIS works and the, both the Z8 and Z9 have IBIs and you think about. I do a lot of panning and panning in kind of like Tarmac Motorsports, like you know, Superbikes or, or you know, race vehicles around Albert park or whatever that, that's actually quite easy to get a good pan because the vehicle's not moving up and down very much. And Justin, you'll know this more than anyone, like a mountain bike is a freaking nightmare to do a panning shot. In fact, the easiest place to do it is if it's in the air. [00:39:29] Speaker A: Yeah. Yep. [00:39:31] Speaker D: Because this thing is getting hammered up and down as they're sort of going down this, this course. And the same's true of off road motorbikes. So it's very hard to do good panning shots at slow speeds with off road vehicles. But I've always thought, well, you've got, actually you've got two things in there. You've got some very sophisticated 3D tracking that can follow a helmet or whatever and you've also got Ibis. So why aren't, why haven't you got Ibis with a panning mode that as soon as you start tracking holds the rider steady in the vertical plane and that would allow you to get a much better success rate in your panning. So anyway, I don't know why they don't do that. It's probably a good engineering reason. The, but the, the, the other things are tiny, tiny little things like, like make the battery door easier to open with gloves on, make it a bit lighter. The focus has still got some areas where it's not perfect. But no, I mean. And yeah, I'll take a higher frame rate and I'll take a pre capture which I think will all come. But what I hope they don't do is put a global shutter in it and lose a whole lot of dynamic range like Sony did. But I suspect they're going to. [00:40:47] Speaker A: Yeah. So that's, that's something you're not interested in yet until the image. Because, because are you, you seeing any issues with that sort of stuff with your sort of sports and like you don't want a global shutter and less equivalent image quality. [00:41:02] Speaker D: I think the areas where it would be helpful. I do a lot of flash photography. So being able to get a full strength a shot without messing around with, you know, the HSS doesn't work very well outdoors long distance. So you end up using the hypersync stuff from Elinchrom. [00:41:24] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:41:24] Speaker D: Which is kind of a different way of, of doing that and that's quite, it's not perfect. So I think with a global shutter you'd be able to use a normal flash and get full power out of it. That would be useful and clearly we'll all take more frames per Second, you know, for the odd occasion you need it, but not at the cost of a couple of stops of dynamic range. Yeah. Which is what. What they're seeing from the Sony. Or at least one stop from the Sony. [00:41:51] Speaker A: That's right. It'll. Yeah, it will be interesting to see where that goes and when we start, you know, like Canon due sometime in the next year, I guess, to release the 6D Mark 3 and it's like. Yeah, everyone's wondering, is that going to end up with Global Shutter and is it going to have the same kind of issues? You know what you mean, the R6. Sorry, R6. [00:42:14] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:42:14] Speaker A: I don't know, there's too many sixes. Yeah, yeah, the R6 mark three. And yeah, at some point all the brands will try out a Global Shutter at some stage and it's like, which model are they going to test it out in and who's going to end up with the model? That sort of, I guess, unless they release a spec. That's why it's so cool with Sony, because it's kind of in that sports one where it's like you've still got the A1 that doesn't have it. So if you want the ultimate image quality and speed, you can just shoot the A1. If you're a professional sports photographer and you don't want to play with that Global shutter in the a9 mark 3, whereas a lot of other brands don't have that kind of sports flagship and, and overall flagship. That's still fast, I guess. Yeah, it's. It's interesting. [00:42:57] Speaker D: I mean, you got. You guys were Talking about the D6 last time, Nikon D6, which is the last of their full frame. I don't know whether you were. But anyway, the last of the full frame. Sorry, last of the DSLR high end pro bodies from Nikon. [00:43:13] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:43:13] Speaker D: And that was such. I mean, like it did one thing really well, which was, you know, it could take great photos in a completely dark room, but it did nothing else. Everything else was just so compromised by that. And I kind of worry with the Global Shutter cameras that you give up so much just to be able to get 120 frames per second of RAW or whatever they're doing and yeah. That it's probably not worth it at the moment. [00:43:39] Speaker B: Yeah, it's a big compromise, isn't it, for a small case. Small use case. [00:43:43] Speaker A: Yeah. Which is why it's great with Sony having it in that Specialized model where it's like, hey, here it is. But we've still got essentially a Full suite of models that don't have that tech in it and you're not forced. Whereas, yeah, if they put it in the Z9, I guess they'll still have the Z8. But, you know, if they put it in the Z9, Z8 combo. Yeah, I couldn't see him doing that. If there was such a big hit on dynamic range. Because so many people use those cameras for landscapes and stuff as well. Yeah, it would be. It would be a major issue. [00:44:12] Speaker B: Yeah, commercial. Especially commercial stuff. [00:44:15] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, that's right. They would fashion just quickly because that reminded me of something. Where is it? You know how you're talking about panning shots. You want to see what was one of the hardest shots I have panning shots I've ever done. That should have been easy. Trying to get this. [00:44:36] Speaker D: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. I get why that's hard. [00:44:39] Speaker A: It shouldn't have been hard, but it took me quite a few goes and I wanted to like. So first of all, just for anyone listening or watching or whatever, it's just trying to get close up component shot with some motion blur and panning. Because it was a release of this component. Well, the whole drivetrain, but, you know, like this. This is the main stuff that we're looking to show in the photo. And instead of just obliterating the blackground with. With shallow depth of field, just having some motion blur, having the tire blur, I think it was. Was what they wanted. And it ended up being used as a YouTube thumbnail and stuff for the review. But just trying to get all of those components sharp. Even though he's not on a really rough trail, but everything is just moving just a tiny bit. Everything's shaking, everything's. Because all of those components, like this component particularly is designed to move with the chain and stuff. So every little bump, it's just. It's just bouncing. Everything's vibrating. And I was going to ask you, like, would you say for a shot like that. And I'm on a fairly wide or not wide, actually sort of like a normal focal length. I'm very, very close. So as he comes past, I'm like whip panning. Yeah, because he's right there. I'm not there was enough space to use a long lens or anything. It was like handheld with. I think I was on the 28 to 70 probably at about. I can tell you, I've got the magic of lightroom. I don't know what I'm trying to guess. I was at 70 mil. [00:46:03] Speaker D: I'm going 160th. [00:46:06] Speaker A: Oh, yeah. Well, I was at 150th. [00:46:09] Speaker D: Oh, close. [00:46:11] Speaker A: That's a very good guess. Would you have stabilization on or off on the lens or the body or both or like, how would you go with when it comes to that stuff? How do you think about it? [00:46:22] Speaker D: Well, on the Nikon, none of the modern lenses have a switch for that. You see, you do it on the back and it coordinates between the two. And I'm being very thought because my understanding is that the, they've got two modes on there. They've got a, you know, full stabilization and sports. And Sports just stabilizes it in one plane. [00:46:40] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:46:42] Speaker D: But what I find is you imagine someone doing a jump where they, they're sort of carving a parabola. I find that the sport stabilization is not terribly helpful for that because I'm moving in two planes. [00:46:55] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:46:56] Speaker D: So I'll definitely turn it off for that. But generally it might leave mine on. I'm, I'm like absolute dimwit. So if I, if I don't sort of get the camera set up at the start of the day, I'll forget about it and shoot it on small JPEG or something. So I, I, I generally leave on Sports, and then if I'm getting a problem, I'll turn it off. [00:47:19] Speaker A: Okay, so you leave it onto sports all day. When you're shooting any, anything, you're at fast shutter speeds. [00:47:26] Speaker D: That's exactly right, Matt. If you're shooting fast shutter speed, you don't need IBIs. Yeah, yeah. I mean, if you're shooting at a 1 1600, you just don't need it. [00:47:39] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:47:39] Speaker A: Yeah. Okay. [00:47:42] Speaker D: Although I will say, I would say with, to contradict myself with the longer lenses. It's helpful from a framing point of view, not having the lens. [00:47:53] Speaker A: Sure. When it feels so nice, when it locks in and just feels steady and then you switch it off and you're like, oh, God, is this what it used to be like? Yeah. The whole thing's just moving around, I think. I don't know if it makes us less steady and our hands are lazier, but yeah, that's, it is true. What, what were you saying, Jim? [00:48:10] Speaker C: Well, you had your photo, so I actually shot this a few months ago because. [00:48:16] Speaker A: Similar thing. [00:48:17] Speaker C: It was a driveline. [00:48:18] Speaker D: Oh, who did it best? [00:48:21] Speaker A: Well, well, I mean, there's not a lot of blur there. I'm just saying. What shutter speed's that at? [00:48:29] Speaker B: That's pretty sharp on the, on the, whatever that is. [00:48:33] Speaker A: 100. [00:48:33] Speaker B: Is that the derailer? Do we still call them derailers? [00:48:35] Speaker A: It Is it. Is the derailleur, Greg? [00:48:37] Speaker D: Yeah. Cost about the same as a small house. [00:48:43] Speaker B: Can you zoom in on that derailer, please, Jimbo? [00:48:47] Speaker D: Oh, it's the real critique coming now. It's pretty sharp. [00:48:51] Speaker A: Just. [00:48:51] Speaker B: Yeah, it is. [00:48:52] Speaker A: It's definitely sharp. I'm just the change. [00:48:54] Speaker D: The chain slap, though. [00:48:56] Speaker A: Yeah, chains got the chains sharper. [00:49:01] Speaker C: Yeah, it was pretty bumpy. [00:49:03] Speaker D: Yeah. [00:49:05] Speaker A: But what. So what focal length were you at? 150. Right. And then the background must be a decent distance away because, like, if you just. If you see the. There's less, like, streaking through the background. [00:49:19] Speaker C: So what's yours? [00:49:21] Speaker A: I'm only at 70th. It was probably a tighter area with more like the. There wasn't a lot of width in the track, so there's probably more stuff close to the bike to blur, maybe. I'm thinking. I don't know, just. So hang on. 70th of a second or what? I was a 60th of a second because I like to record 70 mil. [00:49:42] Speaker C: Yeah, I tried. I think I tried a 50th. [00:49:46] Speaker A: It would have been. Well, this is the thing. I would have given up. Like, I think. I think we did four passes back and forth and. And for. So for. If you're doing like a. Some sort of magazine shoot, four passes is nothing. But for us, when we're shooting like a full. A full review, video and photo hybrid in two and a half hours, we don't usually do four passes of anything. Like, if it's not working, it's like, not next. [00:50:10] Speaker C: Yeah. It was the same with this. [00:50:13] Speaker D: Yeah. [00:50:13] Speaker A: You just keep moving. So, yeah, I probably would have given up quicker. [00:50:19] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:50:20] Speaker A: Had I been under more time pressure or. Or if I'd known because we had. We had done a similar shoot. How's this turned into us talking about. And said Nick. This is supposed to be Nick's interview. What is happening here? Anyway, let's join. [00:50:33] Speaker D: For those of you who are out shooting derailleurs, this is your master class, global audience of three. [00:50:40] Speaker B: It's very nice. [00:50:42] Speaker A: It's a niche, but hey. Yeah. The Americans say the riches are in the niches. [00:50:49] Speaker D: Well, that's right. We should do a beef op workshop on derailer shooting. [00:50:54] Speaker B: Derailer shooting. [00:50:55] Speaker A: Imagine we could crush that. [00:50:57] Speaker D: Yeah. You could bore them to tears for a whole two hours. [00:51:01] Speaker A: There would be no one there. [00:51:03] Speaker B: Hey, I've got a question for everybody. And because I want to raise it, because we talked about compromises in cameras and what will be next in terms of technology, what they're going to do with shutter, sorry, sensor technology and shutter technology and IBIS for that matter. But I think the next biggest challenge for camera brands is actually I don't think we're going to get much more in terms of technological advancements for a bit. The reason being is that the cost of cameras and the cost of manufacturing rare earth minerals and materials, they're just continuing to grow. And I bring that up because we were talking about know the compromises and what's next in pro bodies. But you know, even with entry level or enthusiast level cameras like so for example The Fujifilm X E5 is coming out and that's $2800 and people are complaining about the price because the XT5 is currently the same price which is considered Fujifilm's flagship photography X series camera. And I just wanted to see what you guys think about how camera companies are going to tackle that rising cost of product and manufacturing. And you know, Fuji have just moved reopened factories in Japan to avoid the American tariffs from China made Chinese made cameras and lenses. So they've moved anything that's going to, that's shipping to the US is now made in Japan. And they, they pivoted that pretty quickly. When you consider when this whole tariff thing only started, you know what, a month, six weeks ago? Yeah, it wasn't long ago. But they've, they've moved pretty quick on it and now America is getting product but everyone is concerned about the, what seems to be the higher price of everything. Not excluding tariff, excluding the whole tariff thing. So what do you guys think is going to be the, you know, do you guys think that will be a big challenge for camera companies to put out new models that are actually affordable? Because you know, even if they don't elevate the tech as much as they used to, you know, from body to body, from generation to generation, the cost of those, those products is going to keep growing. Does anyone have any thoughts on that or am I just. [00:53:10] Speaker D: I've got thoughts. [00:53:11] Speaker B: What are your thoughts, Nick? [00:53:14] Speaker D: Well, I, I think you've got to think about it in a, a segment basis. So I think the, the sort of flagship cameras are going to still keep climbing in, in cost. When you think about things like a, a Nikon 400 mil 2.8 lens is like $24,000 and, and 10 years ago they were like 14 or something, 15, something like that. And you're still gonna have to wait a year for one, right? So it's not, they're still selling these things. I mean you, I mean you go and try and buy any of the Fuji or Leica products and they're, you know, premium products for the, what the actual camera does. So I don't, I think on the, on the premium segment it's very price insensitive. You can, you can charge almost whatever you like on there and people are going to pay it. I think the problems in the kind of the mid and the budget end, I think the budget end is now quite well served. You think about is it the Z5 2, the new Nikon? I mean that's a really, really good camera for not a lot of money. It's a bit in the middle where you kind of want most of the features of a Z9 or yeah, Sony A1 or whatever and suddenly it's you know, 5, 6, $7000 and that's a lot of money if you're not making money out of photography. So I think that's where the, the issues are. I think the, the tariff things will settle down. Just rationality has got to return. [00:54:40] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:54:41] Speaker A: You know I think the, the interesting thing though, so that mid range has crept up. It's something that I've noticed. I'm interested because that was where I did get tempted by flagships pretty regularly. But I had a D5 and we shot a lot with the D850 which was an absolute workhorse. [00:54:59] Speaker D: A D850 is a beast. [00:55:01] Speaker A: Best camera ever made in terms of digital slr. Yeah, best DSLR ever made for sure. But we lived a lot in that D750 world because we're wedding photographers so you need multiple bodies. Can't just splash out on everything. Don't need the fastest stuff for weddings. You know, you're not, it's not high end sports. [00:55:23] Speaker D: Oh, you're talking to experienced wedding photographer. [00:55:26] Speaker A: Hey, we need to talk about that too. [00:55:30] Speaker D: The worst wedding in history. [00:55:33] Speaker A: We will talk about it straight after this. D750s though like D750s were like 2 1/2 grand or something and we could create and, and I guess what's interesting though is we look at it now and to me the equivalent of the D750 is what the Z6, Z6 3 which is, I mean it's three and a half grand. So it hasn't actually there's one on special for 3200 at camera. [00:56:01] Speaker B: That's Australian dollars folks. [00:56:02] Speaker A: That's Australian dollars. Sorry, we're from Australia mate and our dollars aren't worth as much as yours. But it's, it's like they've gone up a Bit but they're so much more capable as well in terms of like frames. But you know, we were shooting at six and a half frames a second on the D750 for weddings. That was max. That was it. That's all you could have. [00:56:23] Speaker D: And with a focus area which was like the middle of the frame. [00:56:26] Speaker A: Exactly. [00:56:27] Speaker C: We just made it work. [00:56:28] Speaker A: Buffer. Her buffer was what, what did we do? [00:56:31] Speaker C: It was 11 at the start and we got it to 21. [00:56:35] Speaker A: Yeah. Because you can do raw, like full raw. But we were doing like lossy compressed raw at 12 bit because we needed a higher buffer. And it would also help free up our hard drives and stuff. And you only really get the benefits of 14 bit versus 12 bit under about 400 ISO which for us was almost never during the day. So we're shooting at 12 bit anyway. So we were having to kind of work around camera. That's not a thing anymore. If you buy one of these mid range kind of three to $4,000 cameras, you don't need to work around anything to shoot almost anything. Like it's, they're shooting 20 frames a second or whatever. They got decent sized buffers. The image quality on all of them is great. Yeah, I don't know. So it's. The price has gone up but I think the spec jump of the mid range has just gone through the roof as well. I don't know, am I. I think. [00:57:28] Speaker B: You'Re right because I think there's also a big gap in entry level at the moment. You know, no one's making point and shoots like good point shoots anymore. Like the, you know, little compact ones, they're all mass produced and they just slap a different badge on them depending on who's, who's claiming ownership. Like that little point, that 60 point and shoot I got there was like three different versions of that with different brands on them. Entry level stuff is, is really vacant at the moment. You know it's. We used to be able to recommend cameras when I'd write buyer's guides for Shotkit. We used to have articles about the best digital camera under $500, the best digital camera, interchangeable lens, camera under a thousand. And it's really hard to find that kind of product anymore. You know, all of a sudden you're looking at jumping up to minimum like a 1500-2000 dollar entry level body which used to be know enthusiast kind of pricing not so long ago. And I just, I, I foresee that, you know we were talking, when we, when we were talking about the, you know the XE5 launch and stuff, and we're talking about the X Pro 4 or 5, whichever comes next from Fujifilm. You know, it's one of the most popular models. It's like four and a half years late because the, the three didn't sell very well because of COVID And, you know, I worry about the price of that when it comes out, it's going to be close to four to four. Four to $5,000. [00:58:53] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:58:54] Speaker B: You know, and that's a huge jump from where, where the 4. Where the X Pro 3 cost. It's just so much has changed in that time. You know, scarcity of silicon and rare earth materials running out and all of that stuff is great. [00:59:09] Speaker D: I think, I think there's something else going on with Fuji, which is they become a cult brand. So they're kind of on the Leica wave. They can charge more than. I'm sure. I'm sure their margins don't begrudge them. They've done them. [00:59:23] Speaker A: I was going to say they're kind of ratcheting it up now and it's probably. I mean, Canon did it sort of similarly, but different. If you look at their lens, like their lens lineup for the RF cameras, like, they're significantly more expensive than the EF lenses, but they did it at the same time releasing really great lenses. So people are like, oh, it's four grand, but I really want it, you. [00:59:46] Speaker D: Know, because, oh, my goodness, how good are the mirrorless lenses now? [00:59:49] Speaker C: They're just insane. [00:59:53] Speaker A: And so that's how you can kind of. And Fuji are doing that, I guess, across their whole range where they're like, yeah, the prices are creeping up, but everyone's like, everyone's really happy with the product. So they're happy they're paying that. You know, the X100 is getting more and more expensive, but the camera's great. It's not like they're just. Just putting the price up heaps on the same old. You know, they're releasing a newer upgraded version and being like, oh, we need to push it a bit. And they probably had to push it to regain. You know, we've, we've seen all the, all the sort of the camera brands saying, yeah, they're sort of becoming profitable again. And I think it's because, yeah, they're selling more. Well, not only that, but the prices are much dearer. So maybe there's actually enough margin for them to run their business and make a profit now, whereas 10 years ago they were in that shrinking phase where they were all in struggle town. [01:00:43] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, definitely. [01:00:44] Speaker A: Anyway. [01:00:48] Speaker D: I've just had Craig Murphy, who's the. Who does all the AV for the festival, just text me saying, did you wipe Vaseline in your camera for that glamour look? Yes, I do. [01:00:58] Speaker A: I thought you put a stocking over it. It's quite. Yeah, it's beautiful. [01:01:03] Speaker D: No, It's. It's a 35 mil 18 from Nikon. They're, you know, budget 1 8. Well, budget 800 bucks, whatever it is. [01:01:10] Speaker A: So that's why it's so soft anyway. Sorry. [01:01:15] Speaker D: That's why it looks soft. [01:01:16] Speaker A: Is that one. [01:01:17] Speaker B: I think, I think Jim was going to have a crack at Fuji there. What are you going to say, mate? [01:01:21] Speaker C: I was just going to say that the, the price is probably going up because every time Greg mentions it he gets a little kickback. [01:01:26] Speaker A: So yeah, I do have to pay for them. [01:01:28] Speaker C: They've got to cover those costs. [01:01:30] Speaker D: Welcome to the Fuji cast. [01:01:33] Speaker A: Yeah, I know that's always background lights green. Anyway, let's. So can we, let's talk about this there, let's talk about this wedding. Tell us about the. So you've shot a wedding, Many weddings, one way. Tell us about it. [01:01:46] Speaker D: And I always said I'd never shoot a wedding because I don't know how you guys do it. I'd love to hear your wedding I. Horror stories. But I just went, this is not me. So. But I had. He was actually, you know, effectively my sergeant when I was in the military. And he, he was a superb guy, like the world's best practical joker. And he got promoted to colonel, God alone knows how. And he's getting married for the second time and he, he dropped me a note saying, I'd love you to come and photograph. The wedding was in the uk, I was in Australia and it turned into this slow motion catastrophe on every level. And I went, well, I've never shot a wedding before. And he's like, it doesn't matter. You sure be fine. It'd be just like shooting bikes, won't it? And I really. As long as you don't care about the photos, I'll come and do it. So I'd got. He was getting married in Edinburgh and I was leaving and I'll get this wrong, it was like the Friday night and he was getting married on the Saturday or the Thursday night, he was getting married on the Saturday day. And I, I'd got a flight, a 5pm flight out of Melbourne. I had to work during the day. So I was sitting in the office, I had all my kit with me. And the phone rings and that went, oh, hello. And they went, hi. So this is Qantas. Are you getting on this flight? And I went, sorry. And they said that the flight to, to Singapore, are you getting on it? And I went, well, yeah, I am, but it's not leaving for another three hours. And then no. So I was leaving at three and this was two. And I was sitting in the Melbourne cbd and I'd seen, like, you'd think a military guy would have gone, well, 1500 hours is. Yeah. Get what I did? [01:03:34] Speaker A: Oh no. [01:03:36] Speaker D: So I'm like, so I just grab everything and run, run out the building, grabbing a taxi, throw my bags in the back And I go, 100 bucks if you can get there in 20 minutes. And this guy's like. And I get to the airport and I run into the, you know that where the first class place is, like. And I just go straight into there because that's the nearest place you can get to. And I went, nick Fletcher, I'm, I'm. In the meantime in the taxi, I'm like trying to work out, are there any other flights? This is going to be like, this was a three thousand dollar mistake. I was gonna, it was just like living nightmare. So I get to the airport and I said, I'm on this flight, can I get on? They went, no, the flight's closed. And I went, is the flight actually closed? Is the gate closed? They went, well, we're not taking any more on. I went, but is the gate closed? And they went, no. And I said, okay, will you ring the gate and tell them I will get there before they stop loading the aircraft? And if, will you, will you let me on? And at this point, of course, now I've got carry on bags and I've got my camera bags. So I'm like, right, I need to get rid of these carrier bags. I have to run across the terminal, leave it in left luggage, and then all I've got is my camera bag and I'm running. And the international terminal, you know, that's not. It's like two K's to get to the gate. I tear across and by the time I get them just covered in sweat, I'm just this mess. And they're just closing the gate. And I said, look, I'm not checked in, but I'm on this flight, will you let me on? And there's all this grumbling and they let me on. So I actually get on this flight and I'm getting on this flight and then this one flight Attendant looks at my bag and I've got a tripod strapped to the back. And he went, oh, sir, is that camera equipment? I went, yeah. And he goes, you've got batteries in there? And I go, yeah, I've got batteries in there. And he goes, can I see them? And so he gets the batteries out. And I think I had a battery for the strobe still in there. The strobe that I didn't have with me, it was now in my checked luggage. And he's like, this looks like it's too big to take on an aircraft. No, it's not. And let me explain what hours and amp out. [01:05:55] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. [01:05:56] Speaker D: The flight took off 40 minutes late while they had a conflab with Qantas about this freaking battery. Yeah. Finally get to Singapore, into London and I've got to get up to Edinburgh, but I've got like no softbox, nothing. I don't have a suit, don't have socks, underpants. I had a like, nothing. So I'm, I go, right, I'm at Heathrow, I've got a flight up to Edinburgh in four hours. Got to get into. I've got to get into London, find a photographic shop, buy some soft boxes and a suit. London, buy this and a case to put it all in, make this flight up to Edinburgh. And then the thing itself, he'd said, look, we're getting married in Edinburgh Castle, so. Oh, that's gonna be really cool. He's gonna inform military year. What? I didn't know. I assumed that like he'd be. Have his own bit, you know, it wouldn't be shut off, it was fully open for tourists. So there was like 10, 000 people in this place and they thought this wedding, like guy in full military uniform, Piper, everything was being put on for their entertainment. So. And, and then it gets worse. The actual ceremony is in the oldest church in the uk, which is the chapel in Edinburgh Castle. It's. It's over a thousand years old. [01:07:24] Speaker C: Does that mean the darkest church? [01:07:26] Speaker D: Yeah. Only takes 20 people and it's only got one window which is about this size. [01:07:32] Speaker A: Nice. [01:07:33] Speaker D: And it's got some like. And just, just little things like they came with their piper walking up to the church and they're just getting mobbed by these tourists. And I initially, I just go, well, I'm just going to plow them out of the way with my back. And that just wasn't working. So I then want. One of the guys I used to serve with, is quite a big guy. I went right, you're in responsible of just carving a path through these people and telling you to get out the way. Oh my God, what a disaster. Anyway, a lot of fun. [01:08:06] Speaker B: So you managed to shoot the wedding though, after all that? [01:08:10] Speaker D: Yeah, I'll give you. I'll see if I can find your picture. Hang on, let me just see if. [01:08:14] Speaker A: I can show us how it turned out. I can see here on your website it doesn't advertise weddings on here anywhere. I was looking for it. [01:08:25] Speaker D: Let me. Oh God, what have I done? Oh, here we go. So, yeah, I. Not a huge fan of weddings. I don't know how you guys do it, to be honest. [01:08:39] Speaker A: Well, I don't really anymore. Jim still does it. He loves it. [01:08:44] Speaker C: It's. It's not bad. [01:08:45] Speaker A: It's. [01:08:45] Speaker C: It's. [01:08:45] Speaker D: Let's see if it'll upload. It wasn't uploading photos for. [01:08:48] Speaker C: I guess a lot of people get. [01:08:52] Speaker D: Oh yeah, there you go. There's your little window. [01:08:54] Speaker A: Looks beautiful. [01:08:55] Speaker D: Yeah, I was like 12,000iso. [01:08:58] Speaker A: Nice. [01:08:58] Speaker C: Yeah. [01:08:59] Speaker A: When was this? When did you shoot? [01:09:01] Speaker D: Ah, this would have been six or seven years ago. [01:09:04] Speaker A: Yeah. So on DSLRS. [01:09:07] Speaker D: Yeah. D850 or D750, I think. Let me just go. And this is kind of the chaos. [01:09:19] Speaker C: Sometimes those churches and stuff, it's just. It is what it is. The light is, you know, you can't put up lights and go crazy. [01:09:31] Speaker D: So I literally have to have someone clearing everyone. They walked probably you know, 400 meters up to the church, but I had someone yelling at these people. Get the background. [01:09:46] Speaker A: That's so cool. And I think that's awesome. That is awesome. Jimbo would thrive in that situation. He'd be, he'd be loving it. [01:09:55] Speaker C: Yelling at people. [01:09:57] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. Trying to, trying to do a big group photo amongst hundreds of tourists. [01:10:04] Speaker D: A living nightmare. [01:10:05] Speaker B: So Nick, was your mate happy with the outcomes? [01:10:08] Speaker D: Yeah, yeah, he was. Although got divorced six months later. [01:10:12] Speaker A: Oh, that is a thing. Damn. [01:10:16] Speaker B: Oh. [01:10:17] Speaker A: Now you can't use these photos for your portfolio to advertise. [01:10:23] Speaker B: Yeah, I like this. [01:10:25] Speaker A: This is. I've never done. I don't think I've ever done a motion. [01:10:28] Speaker C: It's very in at the portrait. [01:10:30] Speaker A: Is it? Is it? [01:10:31] Speaker C: Oh, Nick, what they do at the moment is you. Yeah, you. You put the couple in the center, get them kissing or something and then you get the bridesmaids and groomsmen to run around them. [01:10:45] Speaker A: Ah, yeah. Make a bit of a blur. [01:10:47] Speaker D: Yeah, I just relied on tourists. [01:10:50] Speaker A: Yeah, Never done that. [01:10:52] Speaker D: Yeah, it's pretty cool. [01:10:54] Speaker A: Yeah, very Cool. So was there anything good about shooting a wedding? Your experience? [01:10:59] Speaker D: Oh, no, to be honest, absolutely loved it. I mean, I really. Just. Because it was a friend, he was totally relaxed about the whole thing. We got some nice enough shots and, you know, I hadn't seen a lot of people, you know, I'd serve with those people, you know, 15 years before, 20 years before, and I just hadn't seen them. So he's just catching on. That was. Was kind of fun. [01:11:19] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:11:20] Speaker D: And I learned a huge amount. I just got an immense respect for you guys doing weddings and that. That is like a brutal day out. [01:11:27] Speaker A: They can be a big day and a draining day by the end of it, depending on what the. The. Some of them are not bad at all, and then others, you just come to the end of it and you just feel absolutely exhausted and drained just from whether it's from a combination of, like the heat, but also just maybe if it is a little bit extra stress in the day, the people a little bit harder to manage or whatever, and you just come away feeling just absolutely drained. [01:11:54] Speaker C: Sometimes you just click with people and it makes it easy. [01:11:57] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. It depends. Depends on the day. You know what I'd like to hear about a little bit. A little bit of your adventure moto work and stuff like that. I don't know whether we should have a look at some of the images on your website or something. I'd also at some stage like to hear about the work you do with flash and what, like, what you sort of go to is. And especially when you, you know, do you use flash when you're doing some of these adventure things or do you not bother taking it? Like, you mentioned it was interesting you were talking about soft boxes and stuff for that wedding. Like, I don't know, Jim, we probably would if we're worried about light. But like our wedding kit. Yeah, our wedding kit got. [01:12:38] Speaker C: We haven't taken a softbox to a wedding since. For a long time, I reckon. Since we went to like New South Wales or something. [01:12:47] Speaker A: Yeah. So it's like there's a lot of stuff that we. You slowly pare back and pare back once you, you know, if you're shooting your first wedding, you probably take everything. And I'm wondering whether it's similar with your, you know, adventure riding and stuff, where it's like, you know, do you slowly pair your kit back and pair it back to just, you just know what works for that situation? You don't bother carrying anything else. Yeah, that's. That's what I Want to hear about? [01:13:09] Speaker D: I, I, no, I think, I think I've got to the point where I know exactly what I need and it's a little bit as, you know, I mean, you, you carry even less, I guess, mountain biking, Justin. But I know what I need. But I, but it's probably grown over time, not got less. So on most of the rallies I've got one body normally with a 70 to 200 mounted on it. I'll then have like a wide angle, like 14 to 28. F28. 14 to 24, isn't it? Sorry? 1424. Yeah. F28. I'll have something. So, you know, you've got your two choices. You're either shooting someone you know a reasonable distance away or you're absolutely in their face. And I really, really like, you know the close motorbike shots where you're, you know, inches away from them. Yeah. Long shot. Yeah. And that's an example with a strobe, where I put a bit of strobe into to light it. That was for a Ducati new bike shoot, so I got chance to, to do that a couple of times. But, but obviously with the sun, you've only got a couple of chances before that sun is going to be a bit nasty. [01:14:35] Speaker A: So would that, would that have been a, like, what was the setup there with, in terms of your light? What. And, and were you in a car or were you on a bike for this shoot? [01:14:45] Speaker D: I was on a bike, so it was. So I think I was shooting about 15 mil quite wide. And then I had a, I had a dish with gel on the front so that the, the lighting was matched to the sun. Otherwise you get that weird white sort of foreground and, and that was just off to my right. And I can't really, I don't know, I wasn't holding because it'd be my right hand, but it probably on the stand. And, you know, I just said to Nick, just slide it on the edge of that track, because if he'd been close, his natural place would have been in the middle of the track. But then it ended up not being able to get that background. So slide it as close as you can to the edge of the track and just put the front wheel as close as you're comfortable to me, which is how that shot was taken. [01:15:41] Speaker A: Is that in bright or somewhere? Looks. Yeah, it is kind of bright. [01:15:44] Speaker D: Right down left from there. [01:15:46] Speaker C: Yeah. [01:15:46] Speaker A: Yeah. Okay. And what, what strobe do you normally use for that kind of stuff? [01:15:53] Speaker D: That one, I think I had like the Little Ellen Chrome 400. Like a, a battery, big battery. Strobe. But I, I do if I'm on. I generally don't ride with that very often because it's heavy. It's like three kilos or something. I normally just have a little Godox, you know, 860 or whatever it is. Strobe. [01:16:17] Speaker A: Oh yeah. Have you. So, so I was wondering that. Do you ever use the bigger Godox stuff like. [01:16:22] Speaker D: Yeah, I've got two of the big Ellen Chrome or 1200s or whatever they are. I know. Not the big Godox. They don't. [01:16:28] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:16:30] Speaker D: And the 600. [01:16:32] Speaker A: So you prefer. Yeah, that's what I'm trying. And the two hundreds like that one that I've got. [01:16:39] Speaker D: Whatever the one is that's like that. Is it 200? [01:16:42] Speaker A: 200, yeah, yeah. Ton of power for a small light. And that's what I wondered whether that was sort of a go to for this kind of stuff or whether you still prefer. [01:16:52] Speaker D: I do, I do for, for this where I'm not riding very far. I just find having the, that level of power and you know, often for something like this I can get two shots out of it. [01:17:06] Speaker A: In the sequence. Like. Yeah, fast recycle. Okay. [01:17:09] Speaker D: You can't do it out of the smaller Godox. And this is kind of, you know, you've got the flash with you all day here. You're quite lucky you haven't got a huge amount of light because that sun's not quite up. But 15 minutes later, you know, your small flash is probably not going to do it. [01:17:25] Speaker B: Right. [01:17:25] Speaker D: Yeah, particularly I think here I wasn't relying on the flash to stop the action. Yeah, I almost certainly wasn't. So I was probably shooting at 1/1000 and then you're into weird high speed flash stuff. And Alan Chrome does that better than Godox does. [01:17:43] Speaker A: Yeah, let's, let's talk about that. Let's talk about that because it is a confusing subject and maybe some people will be interested in it. It'll be niche like the derailleur discussion. So with flash sync to get your full power flash, every camera's got like a flash sync speed. Most of them are about 250th, some are at 200 or whatever. But it's, it's around there somewhere and that's not enough. The flash will stop action. But if there's any other light, any ambient light coming through, that's not enough to stop action at 250th. Especially for things like, you know, motorbikes and Stuff like that. So then you'll get this weird kind of blurry outline around the subject that. [01:18:23] Speaker D: You'Ve shot with flash, which I quite like. So I do a lot where I'm doing that. So particularly if you look in my bike, my bicycle work, you'll see a whole heap of that. [01:18:37] Speaker A: I love that you call it bicycle too. [01:18:39] Speaker D: Well, just because if I say bike, people think I'm talking about motorbike. Yeah, yeah. [01:18:43] Speaker A: Oh, okay. [01:18:44] Speaker C: Are you shooting slower than 200th? Are you going like. [01:18:47] Speaker D: Yeah, yeah, I'll shoot down to the 60th. [01:18:48] Speaker A: Or like this doesn't have much of it, but it's just got a little bit of it, especially on the bike frame. [01:18:54] Speaker D: But it allows you to blur the background. You see, if I've been shooting thousands, I wouldn't get any. And I use it a lot with kids, really young kids, because they're going at like 3Ks an hour and it's impossible to make them look like they're moving. So if you keep going through, I'm sure we want a young, a young kid. One of the things I say to people is that's not flash, that's obviously. [01:19:16] Speaker A: Just, just a bit of blur. Still cool, though. I dig that. Especially that you've got that one helmet just in. In sharp focus. Yeah, cool. That one's crisp as. That's a great crash. That one's crisp as. So for something like this, I assume you're using the not. So it's. Hang on. So there's high speed sync and then there's. [01:19:47] Speaker D: Hypersync, which is branded term by Ellen Crom, I think. [01:19:51] Speaker A: Yeah. So is this hypersync? [01:19:53] Speaker D: Yeah, that. I think that's two 1200s because he's actually quite a long way away from me. That's 2:12. 2 Ellen chrom 1200s. [01:20:03] Speaker A: And the sun's still decently high too. Like it's not a full sunset shot. Like the sun is in the shot. So, yeah, that would. [01:20:09] Speaker D: Sunrise. I got a. I got. I got a mountain biker out of bed at 5:00am well done. [01:20:16] Speaker C: Well, yeah. [01:20:20] Speaker A: That'S another topic I always love to talk about. What do you think's better to shoot sunrise or sunset? [01:20:28] Speaker D: I don't think matters hugely. But here, which is in Canberra and it was in. It was Christmas actually. We were getting this fog in the morning, so we'd had it for a couple of days and I rang, rang him and said, look, let's get up early and do this. [01:20:46] Speaker A: Yeah, I. I've always thought that sunset is easier to shoot, primarily because Obviously, if you're shooting something specific, a feature, you have to just figure out where the light's going to be and. And that sort of thing. But if you. If you're just going out and then you'll find your shot later. Sunset's easier to shoot because it's like it slowly evolves to the moment where you get the best shot as opposed to sunrise, where it's like you're setting up in the dark. You hope it's going to work. Instantly you get probably the best light and then it gets worse and worse. [01:21:20] Speaker D: That is good call. Well, here's one. This is this guy's Mike Ross or Mike the Sheriff Ross as he's known, who's, you know, one of the best freestyle mountain bikers in. In Australia. He had built that jump the day before. He'd never jumped it. This is his sec. This is his second jump off it and he's never done this trick before. [01:21:44] Speaker A: Well, that's insane. [01:21:46] Speaker D: Right? And then because we would actually. There's a series of shots just before this. I shot out of the bucket of his digger with a longer lens against the sun on one of the other jumps. But this is kind of the first time went over that. [01:21:59] Speaker B: When you say shot out of the bucket of his digger, can you go into a little more? [01:22:03] Speaker D: Well, he had an excavator, so I wanted to get it framed by the trees. It's probably. It'll probably be on in a bit. But he lifted the bucket up so. [01:22:11] Speaker B: That you win it. [01:22:13] Speaker D: Yeah. 20ft off the ground, shooting. But the bloody thing had a hydraulic leak, so it slowly come down and then you need to go and put it back up. [01:22:23] Speaker A: Isn'T it? Yeah. That's crazy. Don't you wish with some of those stories, stuff like that, like. Do you have any photos of yourself? [01:22:29] Speaker D: I've got a photo. [01:22:30] Speaker A: Oh, good. Yeah. Because it's like there's some of those things that happen and because you're so busy doing the thing, you're like. You look back and you're like, man, I wish I had photo video of me doing that. That's very cool. Oh, very quickly got a new, new joiner LTK photo. Hello from North Carolina. United States. Nice. [01:22:49] Speaker D: Welcome to the Americans. [01:22:50] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, welcome. It's good to have you. [01:22:52] Speaker D: Yep. [01:22:54] Speaker A: Love that. What were we looking for? We were looking for. That's a. [01:22:59] Speaker D: Here we go. Okay. [01:23:00] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:23:01] Speaker D: So this is what I do a lot with the young kids because genuinely I can walk alongside them. They're walking at that pace. So if you take Anything with a high shutter speed, it just looks like they're standing there. So it's a really simple technique I use all the time for these kids, which is I put a, just a normal flash on top of the camera. So I didn't have it off camera. Wide angle lens shooting at like 1 60th, 1 80th, 1 40th. And just use the strobe, the instant flash of the, of the strobe to freeze the action. And then so you get a blur in the background. You get the kid's face lit up nicely. Kids are always pulling these great faces. And if you want, you can go even with a fish iron, just shove it right in their face. Parents love it, you know, and it looks like the kid's really doing something. [01:23:55] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:23:57] Speaker C: And they're basically walking. [01:23:58] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. That's awesome. Love it. Okay. [01:24:05] Speaker D: But do you want, do you want my nerd moment on hypersync? [01:24:08] Speaker A: Yeah, that's. I was like, where are we going with this? Yes. Right, so hypersync versus High Speed Sync, which High Speed sync is available across. [01:24:20] Speaker D: Yeah, that's out of the bucket. That was shot out of the bucket. Bucket. [01:24:23] Speaker A: Oh, was it? Hang on. Oh, nice. [01:24:26] Speaker B: That's amazing. That's very cool. [01:24:34] Speaker A: High. Yeah. High Speed sync is what you can get with things like Godox or even most, you know, most Canon Nikon flashes and all that sort of stuff. And am I right in that it, it essentially pulses really fast so that it can cover the whole, like cover the, the 1,000th of a second or whatever is the highest speed shutter and not end up with any black bars or anything like that? [01:24:59] Speaker D: That's right. [01:25:00] Speaker A: But it severely limits your total power. [01:25:03] Speaker D: Yeah. What you're trying to do is because the below 1200, there's a moment where the shutters. There's no shutter covering any part of the sensor. So as long as the flash pulses at that point, you're not going to get any of the sensor obscured by the shutter coming down. You know how the shutter kind of moves like that through the sensor. Once you get above that, there's at any point you've always got part of the shutter, part of the sensor obscured by the shutter. You know, once you get to 1 8,000, it's kind of like that. Now one of the way you solve that is with the global shutter. So it's no, you know, no, no actual shutter. It's just taking the data off the sensor. But if you use a normal flash, that pulse will, will end up with the sensor having a shadow from the shutter on it. So you get those black bars. You're talking about two ways of solving that. The easiest way is, as you say, you just pulse the flash. So it's like a constant light source over that period, but it costs you about a stop as compared to maybe even more as compared to being able to use the full pulse. The other, which is much more of a pain to get right is you use a flash which has a long duration. So as it pulses rather than but it's. But. And the peak of the pulse, you try and get to the period where the shutter is going to be open on the, on the sensor and you rely on that. But what it almost always means is you don't get a constant light source across the whole sensor. It's either brighter in the middle or brighter in the bottom or brighter, brighter at the top. So you can actually change the timing on the, on the trigger normally about when that pulse occurs, but it's much brighter than using an hss. And generally in any of these cases where you're shooting outdoors, particularly motorbikes, where you tend to be a little further away, you're just such an edge case about having enough power that another stop is just like a lifesaver. So that's why I really like those Ellen Crumbs. Eventually when we get to global shutters and we will get there, it might be five years away. That will get solved. [01:27:27] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. [01:27:27] Speaker A: And then it won't be an issue anymore. [01:27:30] Speaker D: No. [01:27:31] Speaker A: So, okay, so what sort of trigger are you using with the Alinchrom lights? [01:27:37] Speaker D: Just an Alinchrom trigger. [01:27:38] Speaker A: So it's just their trigger. And with that you can adjust the timing to make sure you get the pulse in the middle. And so the critical thing with that is a slower flash duration then means it's the camera itself kind of freezing the action, whereas you often get here. Flash duration. People used to want faster flash durations to freeze action back in the day. And so this is kind of, it's the opposite of that. And, and flash duration changes with power. The power output you've got set on the flash and. [01:28:14] Speaker D: Well, that's the other, that's the other complication with, with this sort of hypersync is if you come down to a very low power, the flash duration becomes very fast and it stops working so well. [01:28:26] Speaker A: Yeah. In which case you'd be better off using like high speed sync or something if you don't have much power and you want to freeze action. Yeah, you'd be, you'd be better off. [01:28:35] Speaker D: Practice practically, it's just never an issue because you're almost always on full power. And if it's like slightly overwhelming, you just move it back and forth, you know? [01:28:42] Speaker A: Yeah. Manual adjustment. [01:28:45] Speaker C: Nick, I've got a question about Alan Chrome. So I used to have. I used to have some Alan Chrome lights. And Justin knows what I'm gonna say now. Every other Flash that I've ever used has the standard. [01:29:02] Speaker D: Is this where we're going? Sorry, we don't understand Elinchron power settings. Is this where we're going? [01:29:08] Speaker C: Yeah, I think my old Alan Chrome box, it was this box and you could plug two heads into it and it had from like two Allen Chromes to six Allen Chromes and nothing made sense. It didn't even. Didn't start at 0. It just started like 2 and it went to 6 and it went up in like 2.2.3. 2.2. [01:29:25] Speaker A: The decimal. Decimal points. We had no idea. We were at a wedding and we were like, dial in 3.2 Allen crumbs. That sounds like. [01:29:36] Speaker C: Like, what's an Allen Chrome? We don't know. And like, it was kind of like we were. It was early days and then we kind of changed systems and we were even more confused as why do Alan Chrome have Alan Chromes and not, you know, normal fresh Flash? [01:29:54] Speaker D: I know the answer to this. [01:29:55] Speaker A: I think I know the answer. Can you explain to us also just quickly, Jim, I don't know if they're actually called Alencromes. That's just what I used to call them to make fun of your. Your flashes. I don't know what that. What that measurement is. Hopefully Nick knows what is. What is the measurement on an Al. [01:30:10] Speaker D: I, like this is me guessing from using them. I've never actually googled it to find out. If you think about if you've got like a 400 watt second pack and a 1200 watt second pack. If you did that on fractions, then half of the 400 frat pack would be a much lower light source than half of the 1200. But if they're both set to two Ellen chromes, it's the same power. [01:30:38] Speaker A: Is that real? Is that true? [01:30:39] Speaker C: Okay, so that, that makes sense. [01:30:41] Speaker D: That that's why the 1200 goes up to like 8 and the other one goes up to like 6. I can't remember what it is, but yeah. [01:30:47] Speaker C: Okay, so that's really. Yeah, that's awesome. But you can also just do the math. If I've got a 600 and I've got a 200. [01:30:54] Speaker D: But what's easier Jim, what's easier? [01:30:57] Speaker C: Everyone not having problems? [01:31:00] Speaker A: Well, because everyone else doesn't do it. Everyone does it in fractions, but it actually does. So if you had a studio with eight lights in it, it would be great to know that if you set them all to 4 or 3.2 because for some reason they use decimals and it goes up in odd weird numbers that they're all the same power. That's. That would actually be cool to know. Even if they're a mixture of different lights. [01:31:21] Speaker D: If there's a watcher out there that knows I'm lying, please correct me. But that's right. [01:31:26] Speaker A: No, that's what I do. [01:31:27] Speaker D: That's how I think it works. [01:31:28] Speaker A: We don't do fact checks on this. Roll with it. [01:31:32] Speaker C: We only have had one. We only have had one Alan Chrome light. So we were just like, what's this Random Alan Crom. [01:31:39] Speaker A: What is this number quantity? Well, I'm glad we solved that. Maybe solve that mystery. I'm gonna roll with that. That's a good answer. Let's go. So is that your experience? Because do you have more than one lightning? More than one Alan? [01:31:51] Speaker D: I've got three. I've got two of the big ones and one of the little one. [01:31:54] Speaker A: Is it your experience that if you set them all to the same number, they put out the same power? Okay, mystery solved. [01:32:00] Speaker D: Yeah. I mean roughly. Because I've never got exactly the same modifier on them, but roughly, it's about the same. [01:32:05] Speaker A: Yeah. Okay. [01:32:07] Speaker D: Yeah. [01:32:08] Speaker A: Okay. [01:32:09] Speaker D: Well that souls, I should say Ellen chromes are not perfect. They're really glitchy. Are they? Yeah. And I, I probably my idiocy. But it's, it's. Do not buy an Ellen Chrome if you just need a stripe. Only buy them if you're using them in this, this use case. I don't think they even sell the ladies Ellen Crumbs. They've gone to hss. So I ended up buying all of Ko's kind of old stock of Ellen Crom. So I had them because I could borrow them before, but then they were. [01:32:38] Speaker A: Getting rid of them. [01:32:39] Speaker D: So I said I'll have them. [01:32:40] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. [01:32:45] Speaker A: All right. What else solved that mystery? [01:32:47] Speaker C: Justin, it's been. [01:32:48] Speaker A: Yeah, we solved that mystery. We solved high speed sync and Alan Croms. I'm interested to know more about like the work that you do and also how the. How did you get into working with some of these brands? [01:33:02] Speaker D: Oh, well, the like the joy here. I'm a big believer in go after a niche. Like if you're going to Be a wedding photographer. Like there's hundreds of wedding photographers. So I'm always going to be a bad wedding photographer. Then there's lots of people who shoot bikes. There's not many people who ride bikes and shoot bikes. So we'll actually. Can actually do the ride and then shoot the bike. So I sort of saw that that was an opportunity. So I'd start doing these sort of big rides mainly with a guy called Nick Sellick who's a. Just a awesome, awesome dude. But I'd go with him on his, you know, big organized rides. You know, seven, seven days, often longer with you know, 40 or 50 riders. Oh, there's such a good story to this. You guys ride Jim? You. You ride bikes, don't you Jim? [01:33:54] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. [01:33:55] Speaker A: He rides little ones though. Not. Not these big cool ones. [01:33:59] Speaker D: Do you know who this is? This is a guy called Chris Burch. You know Chris? [01:34:01] Speaker C: Yeah. Bertie. [01:34:02] Speaker D: Yeah, yeah, yeah, right. Total freaking legend, right? So that guy. I was on the KTM Rally which is like this multi day, like it's a 200 total head cases riding these big adventure bikes. And I stopped at this corner and the first people through was these. This couple who decided to do the KTM Rally on a. On one bike. So they were tandem, two up. And I got this. I got this picture which then landed on the front page of the Adventure Rider magazine of the two of them kind of coming around this corner, sliding this bike around the corner. [01:34:44] Speaker A: That. That's in here somewhere, isn't it? [01:34:46] Speaker D: Yeah. [01:34:47] Speaker A: Where is it? That's not it. That's not it. I saw it before. Maybe it was in your other. [01:34:53] Speaker C: I think it was in the overview page. [01:34:55] Speaker A: It was in the overview gallery. [01:34:57] Speaker C: Maybe. I definitely saw it too. [01:34:59] Speaker A: I'll get there and get back because I want to bring it up. Yeah. This one, right? [01:35:07] Speaker D: So they come through one shot, take it next person through. Chris Birch sliding the bike like that. And I didn't think anything of it and I sent all the photos off to KTM. And then this Ms. Magazine comes out and that's the front page. And then the advert on the inside. Same corner. Same corner with Chris Birch riding it. And you can't tell the same corner. [01:35:32] Speaker C: No. [01:35:33] Speaker A: That is awesome. [01:35:34] Speaker B: That's really cool. [01:35:35] Speaker D: That was a lovely little treat. [01:35:37] Speaker A: That is very cool. [01:35:40] Speaker D: But it's just, just seeing. I mean I don't know what he's doing like 140 or something. He's never seen the corner before and he's just really. Oh God. Yeah, he's in fifth Gear. He's just sliding everything around. [01:35:50] Speaker A: I know, but still, I wouldn't have get. I would have guessed more in control than. I guess it's hard to slide at slower speeds. That's insane. That would look cool. [01:36:00] Speaker D: Even he. We were. We were riding there, and even he was sort of trying to keep to the front of the pack. And this is a guy who's finished Dakar. He stopped next to me and went, I'm not riding with these idiots anymore. Because they were just blasting through crossroads and just. It was. Someone was gonna die. [01:36:24] Speaker A: Wow. [01:36:25] Speaker C: So, okay, Nick, for rides like this, are you supplying your own bike? [01:36:30] Speaker D: No, they give you. I mean, I've got my own bike. So with. With Nick Selleck's rides, which are kind of from mixed groups, then I'll use my bike. But for these. Because generally my bike's not on brand. I'll use whatever that. So they gave me a 690 to ride for this and for where? The Ducati. The Ducati shoots. I've done. They've given me a Ducati to ride. [01:36:59] Speaker A: And so this. This is. How long would this ride be? [01:37:02] Speaker D: I think that was eight days. [01:37:05] Speaker A: And just. Just quickly. I know you mentioned it before, but just quickly recap again. Like, what's everything that you would have. [01:37:10] Speaker D: All right. Yeah, so I'd have on you. [01:37:12] Speaker A: On you, like, during the day while you're out riding. [01:37:16] Speaker D: Well, I've obviously got the stuff for my riding, so I've got a first day. One of the interesting things is because you'll stop, you know, whenever there's an interesting trail feature on obstacle or something, you're almost always at the scene of the accident. So I've got. I got a first aid kit, and then I've got a little emergency pack that I've put together to help coordinate the rescue. You know, I've got these flashcards where you kind of write out. Because sometimes you're not in radio, you're not in comms, you've got no mobile phone signal. So I'll have to send someone to another road to get with a phone signal to call an ambulance or call a helicopter or whatever it is. But if you don't write it down, people forget. So I write it. I've got a whole card where I put it down about where they are, what the injuries are, who they are, how old they are, you know, all the rest of it. But. So I've got that stuff, and I've got some warm clothing and I've got the tools for the bikes, and I've got some spare tubes and I've got some spares for the bike and all of that. And then as far as camera equipment goes, I've got a 70, 200 on a. Generally on the Z9. I've got the wide angle lens 14 to 24. I've got something. Often they'll stop during the day in a pub or somewhere. So you're shooting indoors, sometimes quite dark. So I'll have a Prime like a 3518 or something. If I'm doing it for myself, I'll have a strobe. A strobe. I have a drone. I'll then have a, a strobe. I'll have a little collapsible umbrella. I think that's about it. [01:38:58] Speaker A: And tell me, how do you pack all of this? Is it all on a backpack? Is some of it in like panniers and stuff or a top box or whatever you. All the motorbikers call that stuff. [01:39:08] Speaker D: All the photographic kits in. In a backpack. And then it's. I've got a backpack that's like a dry backpack and then that if it's going to be a wet day, that's sitting inside a. Another dry bag with a towel inside so I can at least try and keep it quasi dry. I mean there's a. Generally a lot of river crossings on this. So, you know, and I'm often standing in the river taking the photos. [01:39:34] Speaker A: How so? Okay, it sounds like your gear is not easy to access then if it's in like maybe multiple bags or whatever. Yeah. So is. Is a lot of your stuff not candid, is it. Is it all. I mean, it's candid, but as in like you've got to go. Okay, I'm going to do some shooting here. So it's going to be. It's going to take me a few minutes to get ready to do some shooting. It's not like you just. Yeah, so I'll grab a shot, I'll. [01:39:56] Speaker D: Leap off the bike and then go. Normally they don't see me. It's really weird because they're so concentrated on the track, they just don't see you. But yeah, I'm normally stood beside the track or in the river or wherever. [01:40:11] Speaker C: So are you and are you having to leapfrog them? Like every time they stop you kind of keep going to then. [01:40:17] Speaker D: Yeah, so that, that's the real drama, which is particularly on things like the KTM rally where everyone wants to race. They just see you in their mirrors and they're like this twat past me and you've sort of got this mini race to try and get past them. I'll often try and work out with whoever set the route whether there's a way for me to cut a corner and get ahead of people on some of it. But on these rides, they often have an easy route and a difficult route. And I'll generally try and ride the difficult route because it's more interesting scenery. [01:40:51] Speaker C: Yeah. [01:40:51] Speaker D: And that often prevents you cutting the corner because you can't take, like, a harder track and cut it. You're already on the hard track. Yeah. [01:41:01] Speaker A: So. So is this shot here. Is this on one of those group rides or is this like a. I. [01:41:07] Speaker D: Think this is a personal ride to the drone shot. [01:41:10] Speaker A: Okay. Yeah, that's what I'm like. So, yeah, I'm just kind of trying to get an idea. Oh, that's cool. Obviously not adventure, but very cool. [01:41:19] Speaker C: So how do you. How do you get your foot in the door for something like this? [01:41:24] Speaker D: I. I mean, I. I just. Well, you know, another way Matt is wrong. [01:41:34] Speaker A: Full episode on how Matt's wrong. I think we can have a show. [01:41:38] Speaker D: Never shoot for free. And I'm like, well, yeah, definitely shoot for free when you start, because how are you gonna get good at it? [01:41:46] Speaker A: I was like, I. I've gotten all the cool stuff that I've worked on by shooting for free. I gotta print. [01:41:51] Speaker D: This is exactly my point. Like, I. I tell you how I got to shoot Crank works. I. I live by the beach here, so the wind surfer doesn't often come out. And I'll go out and shoot. I used to wind surf myself, but I'll go out and shoot the wind surfers and the kite surfers and put them up and people can have them for free because I like shooting them is interesting stuff. And this guy called Gregor sort of followed me, and we. I'd always chat to him, and he saw that I was doing all these bicycles and things, and he. And he sort of dropped me an email. Goes, you don't know what I do for a living. And I went, no, no, I don't. He goes, well, I actually, I work for Roller, who do all the roof racks and things for bikes. And he goes, we're sponsoring Crankworx. And we used our own photographer last time. And she's a brilliant photographer, but she's not good at action. Would you do this? I'm like, yeah, sure. So, you know, that's. That's an example of do free work, get paid work. And I. All the way through with the motorbikes everything else. I was like, I really enjoy riding motorbikes and taking photographs of motorbikes. So I do that. And then someone would come along going, oh, we need someone to photograph our Ducati, whatever. And I'd probably, I'll do that. [01:43:04] Speaker B: That'd be great. [01:43:05] Speaker D: So there's no, no magic. And I think part of it is be agreeable, might be easy to work with, you know, like. [01:43:16] Speaker A: Be a good person to hang out with on these shoots and, and useful and. Yeah, I agree. [01:43:23] Speaker D: Yeah, that's right. And sort of, you know, I, I, I, I, I sort of always think about it. I'm not the photographer. I'm here to make sure that everyone here is having a fabulous time and I'm doing a bit of photography on the end. But I'll be far more remembered for the fact that I was, the guy, was a really good guy to hang out. And I helped sort the bike and I sort of, you know, fixed the problems in the background. I sorted out the rescue and just made things easier for everyone. And one of the other things I do is if I do any big events, I, I just produce a book with all the photos in it and I send a free copy to the, whoever organized the ride. [01:44:02] Speaker A: That's awesome. [01:44:03] Speaker D: And that just sits around and they remember me and. Yeah. [01:44:06] Speaker A: And then. Okay, so you send them the book. Then do, do you offer that book for sale for anyone that was on the ride as well? Like, is it, do you do anything else? [01:44:14] Speaker D: It depends. But yeah, sometimes it's not a great way to make money, but yeah, sometimes no. [01:44:18] Speaker A: I was just wondering though, you've put it together and if other people are like, oh, that's cool, I want that book too. You would just. [01:44:24] Speaker D: Yeah, yeah, I do. I didn't do it for the KTM rally for a whole range of reasons, but for most of the other rallies, I do, yeah. [01:44:29] Speaker A: Okay, That's a great idea. Especially. Yeah, providing one to the person who put all the work in just to have a bit of a physical memory of that. [01:44:38] Speaker B: It's also a good promotion. You know, they're thinking, oh, we need, we've got another gig coming up or another event. We need to photographer. Oh, that's right. [01:44:45] Speaker D: Yeah. [01:44:46] Speaker B: We've got, we've got Nick's book. Let's have a look at. Yeah, we need these sort of shots, you know, so it, yeah, it's great promotion itself, isn't it? [01:44:53] Speaker A: Tell me then about pricing, because pricing for sports photography is tricky because everyone wants to do it. There's not a Lot of money in it, generally. But then there is times when you deserve to get paid for what you're doing. How do you. How do you figure out, like, going from working for free to establish an opportunity or to learn or build a relationship or something to, okay, I've been asked to shoot Crankworx or I've been asked to do whatever. Here, here's my rates. And how do you figure out what the rates are? [01:45:31] Speaker D: For me, that's super straightforward. So, like, the first thing is I, I would earn far more money if I just went to work doing my day job than taking photographs. Right. Which is, you know, they're really sad. I mean, I'm, I, Yeah, so I'm a. And, and I don't want to be like a cancer on professional photographers by undermining their business. So part I'm very mindful about is what I'm doing undermining anyone else's business. If it is, I'm not going to do it. Right. So when I shoot free, I do it in environments where either there's no one else doing it or no one else doing it for money. [01:46:09] Speaker A: Okay. [01:46:11] Speaker D: So, you know, I'm really, really. And it was. Even with sort of Bright Festival of Photography, I was very thoughtful about every photographer who turns up, he's going to get paid. So obviously not people are coming to learn the festival, but people are instructed. [01:46:26] Speaker A: I was like, hang On a minute, 500 photographers are actually coming. What is the rate for being. [01:46:35] Speaker D: So, yeah, initially I started by saying, you know, when people came and said, oh, would you shoot for us? I say, yeah, but I don't want to take anyone else's job away. Just pay me whatever you paid the last photographer that did this. [01:46:50] Speaker A: Nothing. No. [01:46:55] Speaker D: And then I sort of, sort of got a better sense as to how people were paid. And I, My, my rates is terrible. Very vary a lot depending on how much I want to shoot it and how much budget I know the person's got to pay. So I don't know. Justin, do you. Do you ever work with Cycling Australia or cycling, whatever it's called these days? [01:47:16] Speaker A: Never have. No. No. [01:47:17] Speaker D: Right. Love them enormously. Total cheapskates, right? When it comes to photography, you just don't have a budget, right? So, yeah, now you. We have a little dance. They'll go, oh, we want you to shoot this. What are your rates? And I'll say, the rates. And they'll say, well, we don't have that one. Just pay me whatever you're going to pay me. And it's you know, 500 bucks or whatever it is a day. Right? [01:47:39] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:47:40] Speaker D: Whereas with like a grown up brand like KTM or Ducati, then I'm charging a sensible rate and what I typically charge is $1200 plus expenses a day. [01:47:50] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:47:52] Speaker D: You could probably charge more but I just go that's kind of a fair rate. [01:47:58] Speaker A: It's interesting, isn't it? Because with brands like Ducati, I'm sure there is a. There are times when they would spend far, far more than that on photography. Say if it's some who's a good. [01:48:12] Speaker C: They're launching a bike or something. [01:48:14] Speaker A: Yeah, I was going to say a Jason Lau level of studio campaign. Campaign that's being planned and there's you know, like there's models and there's wardrobe and it's like this is what we're going to get out. This is the. [01:48:25] Speaker D: But you've got to remember they're doing that in Europe. [01:48:29] Speaker A: That's right. Not in Australia. Yeah. And whereas there seems to be a different level of I guess investment when it's more sort of run and gun action. Hey, we want to send you on this trip to get these photos that we can use for whatever is. Do you agree with that? It's like, seems like it's kind of a different look. [01:48:52] Speaker D: All the mountain bike and motorbike world doesn't have a huge budget for photography. I'm sure that's right for some of their really big new bike launches. [01:48:59] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:49:00] Speaker D: But most of the activation goes on at a country level and that's people like me getting paid that sort of level. [01:49:08] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. [01:49:10] Speaker A: Do you shoot video as well? [01:49:12] Speaker D: Not just avoid it, but you will. [01:49:15] Speaker A: If you have to. [01:49:16] Speaker D: Well, like crankworx. I remember that the, the marketing lady I was working for said, okay, well if we could have, you know, like perhaps every couple of hours, bit of edited video and then the stills and then I just went, just me and there's four events going on simultaneously. [01:49:40] Speaker B: What? [01:49:41] Speaker D: And actually it's like an hour's walk just to get partway up the course and by the way, it's 40 degrees. So, so we, we. I sort of said look, I'll shoot some video. I'm. I'll give it to you the end of the day. You can edit and send it off. But yeah, I argued quite hard not to do that, but in the end I did it because it was important to them. But it's just, I'm just not good at it. [01:50:06] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, makes sense. Is it something you want to try and do more of or you're not. It doesn't interest you? No. [01:50:12] Speaker D: Just because I allocate the editing just bores me to tears. [01:50:16] Speaker A: Yeah. Very quickly on a talk about a couple of comments that have popped up because we've got out. This is our first ever Twitch comment that wasn't a bot, which I'm very excited about. This is Maple Glades says, hey, always great to find new photographers on Twitch. Also, pro tip for the producer of the show, I guess that's me. I don't even know. Tagging photography on your stream is a great idea because it's the main tag photographers use here to find new people. Okay. I'll have to figure out how to do that. That's exciting. That's our first proper Twitch person. That's. That's very cool. Thanks, Maple Glades. And we've got technique fpv. Been doing some research for about a week. Just bought my very first camera today. Canon R10. I get home and see a live stream. Well, this is the perfect place. If you watch this show twice a week, you'll become an amazing photographer. I guarantee it. [01:51:11] Speaker C: In one year you will get your. [01:51:13] Speaker A: Money back or you get your money back. We'll refund everything that you pay us. [01:51:17] Speaker B: But yeah, where are you watching or listening from? [01:51:20] Speaker A: Tell you where you're watching from. And what, what lens did you get for your R10? It's a great little camera you'll have. Is it R10 or 100 R10? Is there an R10? I don't know. And finally, Pete Mallow's fun factor. Hey, Pete. Fun factor gets the discount. That is true. Like when it is an opportunity, you know, I, I do a lot of work for a client in rescue training and rescue stuff. And they were doing a rescue competition in Taiwan. Three days run and gun. Like they're just literally competing in a rescue competition. And I said, if you bring me over there, I will shoot just for my, like my very, very, very lowest rate is, you know, basically like I'll charge you next to nothing to make a full like 20 minute documentary video thing with interviews and everything. And also shoot stills the whole time, hybrid coverage. And we didn't like, I didn't stop all day and it was sweaty as balls in Taiwan. But it was, it was amazing. I had so much fun because when, when I first mentioned it to him, I was like, would you like to get content from this? He's like, I'd love to, but I can't afford to pay you to come over there and pay your full rate. Every Day and I was like, no, I want to come. You just get me over there and we'll figure something out and I'll make it. I'll make as much content as I can to make it worthwhile for you. And I had a great time. So. Yeah, nice. Perfect. Just subscribe. Thanks. Thanks for subscribing technique. It's good to have you here. Where are you from? [01:52:50] Speaker B: Let us know and if there's anyone else in the chat. Just on that. If there's anyone else watching or listening along live with us right now, jump in the chat, let us know who you are. Say G' day. That's an Australian term. Say good day and let us know where you're watching from. And yeah, and if you are watching this episode, please make sure to like helps us out a lot. It gives the algorithms, you know, juice to let other people know that we're here. And yeah, hit subscribe. Tickle the bell. You get notified every episode that's coming up. [01:53:21] Speaker A: Yeah, do it. Thanks. [01:53:23] Speaker B: Do it. [01:53:24] Speaker D: Have we gone longer than Matt yet? This is very important to me. [01:53:26] Speaker A: Oh, hey, I was about to ask. Do you have a hard time. You need to be out of here by. But if we just have to go longer than Matt then. Let me just check that I was. There's a few. What else do we want to talk about? I want to talk about the most. [01:53:39] Speaker D: Important thing we haven't talked about. [01:53:42] Speaker A: No, what's the most important thing? [01:53:44] Speaker D: Befop. [01:53:45] Speaker A: Okay. Well, should we go there? Should we go there now? Is there anything else? Hang on. Before we do, is there anything else from your work, your website, anything else you wanted to share, image wise? If you got like a all time favorite image or photo trip or anything that we should have a look at? Something with an epic story. [01:54:04] Speaker D: Oh, I think. I don't know whether there's a couple maybe shots from going to Amadablam in November 23, which is like a big mountain. Have I got some. Let me give you a idea of the mountain. It's something I'd always, always wanted to climb and finally had enough time and money to do it in. Let me just see if I can share it here. But it's a sort of 7,000 meter mountain in Nepal and that was just such a special trip. [01:54:43] Speaker A: You climbed it? [01:54:44] Speaker D: No, I failed to climb it. I'm going back in November this year to try again when we put them up. Let me try one more and see if it'll do it. Why doesn't it like it? [01:54:56] Speaker A: Oh gosh. Matt's episode went for two hours and 25 minutes. We still got 30 minutes to get past him. [01:55:02] Speaker D: I'm actually going to put a photo I didn't take up only because it just shows. It's not letting me put my photos up. But let me put one of Jackson Grove's photos up just because it shows. Let's see if it'll. Let me do it. Come on, you've got this. [01:55:16] Speaker A: Hang on, let me see. [01:55:18] Speaker D: No, won't let me do it. [01:55:20] Speaker A: Oh, that's weird. It's not on your. [01:55:22] Speaker D: It might be. If you go to adventure and other on there. It might have some on there. Just have a quick flick. [01:55:28] Speaker A: Yeah, let me bring it up. Just crank through here and see. I mean, that's pretty cool. Don't know where that was. Just yell out if I, I, I was looking at these before, actually. I love these shots. [01:55:47] Speaker B: Yeah, it's amazing stuff in here. [01:55:49] Speaker A: Yeah, there's some great stuff in here. [01:55:51] Speaker B: How much diversity of, of content and experiences. [01:55:57] Speaker A: Imagine if you did it all day, every day and didn't have to go to a job. Crazy. Imagine how good you'd be. [01:56:06] Speaker C: That's probably what keeps you loving it, though. [01:56:08] Speaker D: Yeah, you're probably right. [01:56:09] Speaker C: I think, I think doing it all day, every day, when it has to be, has to be done and you got to take the jobs that you. [01:56:15] Speaker A: Don'T want to do, when, when to. [01:56:18] Speaker C: Make, to make the dollars make sense, then I think that's where the love gets lost. [01:56:23] Speaker A: I love that when you can only. [01:56:25] Speaker C: Take on jobs that you want to do, not because you have to. [01:56:29] Speaker A: This is. [01:56:30] Speaker D: Oh, there you go. All right. So that's the, that's the mountain. Yeah, that's the mount. That's amateur. Blam. So it's, it's near Everest and it's just as you walk on the sort of Everest base camp track, it just dominates the view on the right. And it's, it's a beautiful mountain, one I've known since I was like a teenager and always, always wanted to go and try and climb. And it was just such an eye opener, going out and doing. Never been to Nepal, never been that high. Went with Evelyn, my wife, and just had this brilliant time. And if you haven't been to Nepal and haven't, it's just photography. Just so spectacular. Everyone's so friendly. All the infrastructure's there and if you don't go too high, it's like really, really, really doable. I mean, you know, it's a little bit basic, but it's really doable. But Once you got on the mountain, like I'm. I always, you know, go. Well, I always prioritize carrying camera gear but by the time I got towards the top I was like, I can only take an iPhone and a little pocket camera. I am so I just cannot carry anything more. Yeah, it was a huge, huge drama. Anyway, we got, we almost got to the top and we'll go, we'll go back later this year and give another guy. [01:57:45] Speaker B: Can I ask what stopped you? [01:57:48] Speaker D: What was it I got. We both got stopped for different reasons. I, I got. In fact, let me see if it was. Play the video. I've got a video of kind of me just back in the tents. Let me see if it'll. Let me share the video rather than me explaining. You can see that rather tired me. Is it. Will it do audio on the video? [01:58:10] Speaker B: Will it? [01:58:11] Speaker A: It might. Let's just see. [01:58:15] Speaker D: No, I am properly worked. I don't know whether it's a chest infection or something else, but I've been puking for the last couple of days, three days. And that meant that I had to stop eating so I could take water on board anyway. So that made any time it be pretty marginal. So I went for it and got past way up the gray cool and just started puking. I couldn't stop and that meant I couldn't take any more water on. So I was eventually supposed to turn around and come back. What I hadn't appreciated was just how buggered I was. So getting back last night was hard work but not too bad. But then this morning trying to get from Camp 2 to Camp 1. Jesus. With not having eaten now for three days. Wow. That was. Anyway, there you go. That's it. [01:59:31] Speaker A: Wow, that is brutal. [01:59:34] Speaker D: Yeah, I had, I had this bit where I, I just. It was sort of rock climbing but it was traversing and we had to sort of scramble about 100 meters across and it was about a 10 meter altitude gain. It was the only bit of altitude gain on the descent to get to actually that camp. And it probably took me two hours to do it. I was just so screwed. [01:59:55] Speaker A: Oh man. Well, anyway, were you scared at all like that that you weren't like, gosh, what if I can't get down or what? You, it never got that bad that you didn't think you could keep going? [02:00:09] Speaker D: No. Well, it caught me out in that. I, I was sort of second guessing should I just keep going and just do it without water and puking? Just feeling terrible and I just like my grown up brain went, nah, you're better off turning around here. And it caught me out. Just if I had done that then that would have been a drama. [02:00:29] Speaker A: So you're going back this year to try again better prepared? [02:00:35] Speaker D: Well, it's just trying not to get ill. [02:00:37] Speaker A: Okay. Just lots of vitamin C. What camera are you going to take this year? [02:00:47] Speaker D: Well, I reckon cramping my leg. I reckon I'll have the X100VI in my pocket probably. I just, it really blew me away. I mean my, my superpower is walking up here with a rucksack on my back. I can do that all day and like, you know, even as a 50 whatever year old, still destroy much younger people. But as soon as I got like above 6,000 meters, just putting one front of it for foot, foot in front of the other became dramatically difficult and I just, I had to start. I mean I, I was so sure I was going to be climbing with my Z8 and A, you know, relatively wide angle lens and I just, I can't do it. I just cannot carry this. If you're going through your bag going, oh, I don't need that battery. I just like, I cannot carry any more weight here. So it was. Yeah, you're pretty marginal. Maybe I'll be stronger then. Who knows? [02:01:43] Speaker A: Maybe. Okay, so. Yeah, but you think maybe. Yeah, X100, not GFX100RF. I mean it's not much heavier. [02:01:51] Speaker D: No, probably not. I mean just the, the. [02:01:54] Speaker B: It doesn't have ibis. [02:01:55] Speaker A: No Ibis. You wouldn't, it wouldn't. What if there's Quake? It wouldn't. [02:02:00] Speaker D: It won't go in the pocket very easily either. Yep, yeah, it's true. [02:02:06] Speaker A: Interesting. What else? Hang on, what else before we talk about bfop? Well, I did. Okay, I did have a question here of like, what is, what's on your mind for the future when it comes to photography? Is there stuff that you still want to achieve as a photographer? [02:02:30] Speaker D: Oh yeah. I've got a million, million, million, million things. [02:02:34] Speaker A: Tell us a few. [02:02:37] Speaker D: Well, when I'm very. I'm doing a little project at the moment which is I'm shooting all the young BMX's who will go to the Olympics in 32 in Brisbane. So that I've got a, you know, an archive of kind of their trajectory. I mean Australia produces some of the best BMX riders in the world. I mean we just had actually a local rider from Victoria just won a world championship round. Jolly just won a world championship round. So it's very likely that I'd be gobsmacked. If we didn't win a couple of medals and maybe a gold medal at the Olympics. And to follow those kids from like, you know, 12, 15 year olds all the way through is super special. So I've got that, that going on. So I spend, you know, a fair few weekends every year following them around. I sound like a, sound like you should be on a register following kids around, around Australia. [02:03:39] Speaker A: It's for work. Okay. [02:03:40] Speaker D: Yeah. So that, that's a, a big thing. I've stopped doing so much motorbike riding in the last this year because I don't want to get injured prior to going to Nepal and also want to spend weekends training. So I'm looking forward to getting back in that. And, and I want Nick Selleck, who does those rides to do another really big outback ride and then probably gone. They, they do some really interesting rides in places like Morocco and just get time to go and do those. So there's a whole lot of things and I do a lot of street photography in my own time, which I never show anyone. But just, just getting a better portfolio, there would be another piece. [02:04:27] Speaker A: Have you ever, have you ever done anything like an exhibition or have you ever wanted to? [02:04:33] Speaker D: No, I do, I print my work quite, quite often. But no, I'm like, I'm very curious on this sort of the work I like best. I've never shown anyone. [02:04:48] Speaker A: That's cool. [02:04:51] Speaker D: I'm much more open with the sports work, but the sort of the, this, you know, the street photography I've taken, I sort of, I've always been sort of scared to show anyone in case they went, oh, I don't like it. So I haven't never shown anyone. [02:05:06] Speaker A: Do you have any street photos that you could show us right now? [02:05:12] Speaker C: Is that nose and you don't have them or. [02:05:14] Speaker A: No, I thought we're going to get an exclusive. [02:05:18] Speaker B: No, no, we won't tell anyone. We won't share it. [02:05:22] Speaker A: Yeah, I won't post it into the Beef Up Groupies, but it sort of. [02:05:25] Speaker D: It plays a little bit into bfop. I had this amazing experience where the guy who took that photo is a guy called John Gollings. He's probably Australia's most famous architectural photographer. And it's a, that's a picture of an Egyptian tomb. But I went to, I went to his studio and he did a little presentation. He goes, I'm just going to show you something I've never shown anyone before. And he starts showing these unbelievable aerial photos. And he said, I've like, I've always been Passionate about aerial photography. I've never shown anyone. I've never sold one so much. So he's got his own pilot and plane. Like, he's done this for 30 years, or most of these are print and this beautiful stuff. And he was sort of a bit like me, which is like. I kind of. Is really special to me, and I don't want it to have external scrutiny. And it was lovely. And I beef up a little bit about that, which is sort of, you know, people go and take photos which they're incredibly proud of, very vulnerable about. So you can absolutely destroy someone by just going, well, it's not very good, is it? And, you know, those. Like, the Internet's full of these people. And just in a moment of thoughtfulness, thoughtlessness, you can. You can really damage someone. And I just beef up, for me was create an environment where that never happens. [02:06:58] Speaker A: Yeah. [02:07:00] Speaker D: And where everyone can be sort of proud and there's sort of like a supportive environment where we're celebrating sort of everyone's photographs. [02:07:08] Speaker B: Yeah. I think Nick, being a street photographer myself, there is a bit of a vulnerability about it because there's also. Street photography can draw a lot of criticism just as. As an actual genre, and a lot of people just don't get it. And so a lot of the work that I shoot when I do go out and, you know, I might. I might put up one image, one or two or, you know, a small collection if I'm really happy with the outcomes. But most of my work, no one sees because it's more about my exploration of my craft and my local area. And, you know, it's more for me than for anything else. But I. I understand that kind of. That. That vulnerable. That way it makes you feel vulnerable because a lot of people. Yeah, like I said, a lot of people criticize street photography. They think it's intrusive and benign and, you know, so it is interesting. [02:08:02] Speaker A: The other thing with street photography, I find is from the. The street photographers, I don't. When you're not as good as they are or as cool as they are, I feel like my photos don't say anything or whatever, you know, like. Like they're not. They're not proper street photos because there's not this thing that I don't know how to make yet that. That street photographers seem to talk about where, you know, it's like there's a narrative. It's. It's on a. Yeah, it's on a higher plane to just a regular photo of something that happened kind of. Or Something, something like that. Anyway. I'm still trying to figure it out but there does seem to be a little bit of a, a risk that if you put something out as a street photo that someone will might throw rocks at it and be like, well that's not street photography or something like that. And, and you shouldn't worry about those people. But it does, it can still be a little bit of a. It can affect your choices of what to share sometimes if you're less confident in your work. [02:09:11] Speaker B: Yeah. I remember sharing a photo not that long ago, probably at the start of the year and it was on Flinders street and it was hot and there was 2 Flinders street at the Elizabeth street exit, Flinders Street Station. And I had two people that were walking in opposite directions and one was pointing and the other was doing something unique and, and I really loved the photo. It was one of, you know, it was one of my favorite photos from that day and I put it on our, one of the photography, photography communities, I mean on Facebook and the first comment was a big deal. Two people walking down the street. I don't get it. And it absolutely destroyed me. [02:09:46] Speaker D: I mean I, I saw, I saw that photo. Greg. It was. Thanks. [02:09:55] Speaker B: How do we kick Nick out? [02:09:59] Speaker C: Did you comment in that group? Nick? [02:10:04] Speaker A: His burner account? Yeah, just absolutely pasting anyone that's been to befop and he's just like that. You're terrible. [02:10:16] Speaker D: You know I did that to Matt. Do you? I created a burner account. I created a burner account and I would just, every day I would just send him an email asking some really dumb comment to wind him up about this stuff and where like I, I, I sent him an email saying I've now got a ticket. Can you tell me where my accommodation is? [02:10:40] Speaker A: Oh you, you were pretending to be a. Oh, that is amazing. He would have been getting so. [02:10:49] Speaker D: Mistake. I made a mistake. I commented on one of his photos and I hadn't switched my profile so I commented as me following on from a comment from this guy but. And he was like oh, I've got you. That's rough. [02:11:05] Speaker B: That's very rough. [02:11:07] Speaker A: Oh, that is, that is so good. 1, 1 Quick comment before we actually let's, we'll, we'll dig into, we'll dig into BFOP Deep. LTK photo says I went to the Build Expo in New York last week which looks very cool. We're going to talk about that in a future show. It was my first time doing street photography. I just enjoyed taking photos of everyday life. Street photography groups. I assume you mean like on Facebook and stuff are rough? Yeah, they seem to be. Sometimes. [02:11:36] Speaker C: I'm not. [02:11:36] Speaker B: Well, it depends on the group. Some, some groups are really good because they tend to get it, but it's when you post it into general population stuff that people just go, big deal. So what, you know, like you get that kind of, that, you know, you think that you're creating an artistic, you're capturing an artistic moment of something that's just random, that would never be repeated again. You know, you think that there's that special. You know, you think it's special in some way and yeah, people just come along and tear into it. It's. Yeah, it's hard. It is hard. But let's talk about bfop. [02:12:13] Speaker A: Yeah, I think we've heard the origin story of BFOP maybe once or twice, but I kind of want to hear Nick's version of it, even if it's abbreviated. How did you, how did you end up running a, starting and running a photography festival in Brighton? [02:12:29] Speaker D: Well, it's a story about beer in that the buffoon from the very start of this who I'd go motorbiking with this guy called Rupert Shaw. And he and I have been friends even on in uk and he actually ended up coming up to Bright and stayed at my place. This is lovely. And moved up there. And he ended up running Bright Brewery. And he also ran a big festival, doesn't run anymore, called the Adventure Travel Film Festival, where he got these kind of independent filmmakers who travel the world making these really cool films and they'd come and stay and I'd help him out with it. And he, we needed a beer sponsor for the Museum of Australian Photography. And I went to see him and I said, hey, you should give us free beer. And he, and he went, okay, if you run a photographic festival. And I, I sort of remember going, well, that can't be that hard. Yeah, sure. What Freaking. So the first year I, I, I set this thing up and I, I had no, I wasn't a terribly good photographer, knew nothing about festivals and I just ran this, this festival and I went, I don't know, how much do you charge for a photographic. I know, 75 or whatever. It was 100, I can't remember. It was. And we had like 150 people came and it cost me. I lost like three and a half thousand dollars running this for the thousand dollars of beer that Rupert gave me. And it was a like a total car crash of a festival. But it was just had a kind of fun vibe that accidentally Got created because I had no idea what I was doing and I'd sort of, I just sort of fallen into people who are still with the festival, like Matt, like, I can't remember who connected me to Matt. And I went, oh, you should. You teach photography. You should come and do this. Why? He did it like this idiot who knows nothing about photography set this festival up. But he came and did it. And at the end of that I was like, I'm never doing that again. But everyone was, you have to do this, you have to do this again. And that's the origin story. [02:14:46] Speaker A: Oh, we are glad you did. What, what was the first year of it? [02:14:50] Speaker D: I think we, I, I, we can never quite work this out. I think it was, this is the ninth year this year. So whenever that was. 14, was it? Yeah, something like that, that. [02:15:04] Speaker A: And so for those of you listening, this festival is happening this year in October in Bright. It's already sold out, so don't even bother if you haven't got tickets yet. [02:15:13] Speaker D: Ah, unless, unless you're. I want someone from the US to come over. So if you're sitting in the US genuinely US citizen and you want to come to this festival, drop me a note, I will get you a ticket. [02:15:25] Speaker A: I love that. Come over, come and visit. You can hang out with us, jump on the podcast. We'll be there this year. Jim will be there for a very small. [02:15:34] Speaker D: You're sponsoring it, part of it, aren't you? [02:15:36] Speaker A: Yeah, we're involved, we're doing stuff, we're, we're making things happen. [02:15:39] Speaker D: I think we can announce, I don't know whether Matt's actually sorted that. You're going to be our media partner, aren't you? [02:15:44] Speaker A: That's the plan. We're going to, we're going to do podcasts, we're going to do, I mean, look, I don't know what we can talk about but you know, we're going to do lots of stuff. I really want to do a lot of behind the scenes documenting. Like last year we took some photos. I wanted add some video to that. Very, very low production value. Probably the lowest production value possible of video. But that's the plan to try and get, to try and capture some of the specialness that everyone talks about. That's, it's really hard to convey. Everyone just says it and it's, it's hard to get across like what it really feels like to be there and just to have fun and chat to heaps of people. It's gonna be cool. I, I want to, I Think the cool thing about being a media partner is I can hopefully go to any of the workshops I want without having to register for them. So I'm just pretend to be bringing this. I'm covering that so then I don't have to fumble my way through the, the online booking thing like I did last year and miss out on all the ones that I wanted to go to. [02:16:48] Speaker B: You can finally do that drone workshop that you wanted to do. [02:16:51] Speaker A: That's right. Although Tom Butt isn't there this year, I don't think. [02:16:53] Speaker D: Oh no, we've got a drone. The, the DJI guys are going to do one. [02:16:57] Speaker A: Boom. All right, well, I'll, I'll cover that and cover any of the other ones that I'm really excited about. [02:17:06] Speaker D: Last time we, we ran one with dji. I can't believe it was a Tom one or the one before, but people just kept crashing the drones into the mountain. It cost them a fortune. It was brilliant. [02:17:16] Speaker A: Oh, because they supplied the drones. [02:17:18] Speaker D: They supplied the drone to people like, I got my drone. Here we go. [02:17:22] Speaker A: Oh, gosh. Great question from Beef Upper Philip Johnson. Hey, Nick, is Sony returning to beef up this year? [02:17:31] Speaker D: Yeah, they are. They've, they've, they've signed up. I think they're going to be better prepared this year. We almost killed them last year. And, and what's blown my mind so if you haven't been to this festival, it's like the world's most amateur photographic festival. It's a total shit show and it's, it's chaos. And you then bring these like grown up brands and it's, you can see them. It's like they're, they're watching this car crash go on and sort of thinking, this is kind of good, but it's also a bit scary. So you, you know, Sony were probably the ones who I went, oh my God. And we thought, yeah, totally. But they've come back and then what's blown my mind? Leica. Leica have just signed up. [02:18:17] Speaker B: What? [02:18:18] Speaker D: I know. Good news. [02:18:24] Speaker A: Tell me they're bringing gear that I can use. I'm gonna end up money. Oh my God. [02:18:30] Speaker D: I got a prize. [02:18:32] Speaker B: Wow. [02:18:32] Speaker A: I'm gonna make so much money. I hope they bring a film camera. I hope they bring an M6 that I can use. I've been, I've been looking. [02:18:39] Speaker B: Might have to pack some film. [02:18:41] Speaker A: Wow, that's massive news. Leica. That is so freaking cool. [02:18:47] Speaker B: I can't believe anyone. Just very quickly, for anyone that doesn't know what be so it's a bright Festival of Photography. It's held in Central Victoria and Bright every year. Bright is probably one of the most beautiful parts of Victoria you could imagine. But if you want some more information, we've done some podcasts about it in the past, look at some of our random photography show episodes. But there's also a blog on the Lucky Straps website that goes into a bit of detail with some images from Justin and I. So if you go to Luckystraps.com have a look at the blog site and you can get a bit more of an insider into, into the, the magic and madness of bfop. It's a little bit of both. It is, you know, Nick, I know you say it's, it's a show and it's, you know, and it's amateur hour and that sort of thing, but there is something very unique about BFOP that everyone walks away from going, oh my God, I can't wait for next year. You know, it's just. There is something very magical about it. Justin and I was our first time last year and we didn't really know what to expect and we, I think we both walked away. I know on the, on the car ride home, we just, we're just going, oh, and then this happened. Oh, you remember that. Then this happened and then, you know, it was just such an incredible experience. So hats off to you for that. [02:20:02] Speaker D: Well, thank you. [02:20:02] Speaker B: Any, any other exclusives we can expect this year? Anything, Any sneak peeks? [02:20:10] Speaker D: We've got, we got a kind of a cool Friday night thing like last time, variation on the theme. What else have we got? We've got a, we've got a much broader group of instructors this year. [02:20:26] Speaker A: Very cool. [02:20:27] Speaker D: It's a whole lot of new instructors. [02:20:29] Speaker A: For those, those that are listening. Like how many instructors, those that haven't been before. I mean, how many instructors do you normally bring to this three day festival? [02:20:37] Speaker D: There'll be 40, I think this year. [02:20:40] Speaker A: 40? Yeah. It's crazy. There's. There are high level photographers everywhere you look. It's. [02:20:47] Speaker D: Yeah, yeah, yeah. [02:20:48] Speaker B: And I think another part of the, the magic of Bright of be is that you'll be walking, you'll be walking over to the fish and chip shop to grab lunch or to the cafe in the morning and you'll bump into four or five photographers, you know, everywhere you look during the festival. It's just people who speak your language and know your craft everywhere. [02:21:06] Speaker A: It could be, it could be a senior cps, like service person from Canon and then the next person you talk to is, you know, an extremely High level photographer who's won all sorts of awards and stuff and you're just chatting to them like anybody's there and they want to talk about gear or want to talk about photography or whatever. It's not, it's not this exclusive. You know, the, the instructors are all over here and you only talk to them during your sessions or when they're on stage or whatever. It's like, you know, they'll be having a beer after the, the day's over. Just watching the chaos unfold on the stages or whatever's happening that night. It's. Sometimes they even smash Sony's. It's great. [02:21:50] Speaker D: One of my millions of cock ups. But it's one of the reasons why I still, I still do this is I just, I love hanging out with both the participants but also the kind of, the instructors. You just get to meet the really cool people and you learn so much just hanging out with them. [02:22:05] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, most definitely. [02:22:07] Speaker A: Hang on, let's see how many people. [02:22:09] Speaker C: Are going to be there like for ticket, ticket holders. [02:22:13] Speaker D: Oh God, that was so bad. [02:22:17] Speaker B: Look, this is so good. [02:22:18] Speaker A: This is you smiling, not saying stop. [02:22:23] Speaker D: I thought Matt was gonna do it, but I, I watched your video and he didn't. I thought he counted down to one. He didn't. He stopped at two. I thought he was going to stop at about five and it was going to be fine. But there you go. [02:22:33] Speaker A: Anyway, that's the story. Sony, that was a working camera. The, the, the thing was basically, hang on now, it won't zoom back out again. Why? Why? Anyway, if I go to this and then this, what was the challenge? Basically if you wanted the new camera that may or may not be in this box, you have to smash your camera correct to get it. And the idea was you were going to like. Ah, just kidding. You can have the box anyway, you know, like we just wanted to see if you were willing to put the camera on the line and. And he did it. He hit it. Was there a camera in the location? Absolutely, yeah. [02:23:09] Speaker B: He's got a brand new Z72. Yeah, Z72. [02:23:13] Speaker A: And look how absolutely happy he is. Yeah, that's the joy. [02:23:17] Speaker B: He didn't care. He was pretty happy to do it. Yeah. And I've actually got a photo that I took the very next morning of him sitting with one of the Nikon reps learning how to use his new camera. So it's that there's also that sort of support. [02:23:31] Speaker C: Yeah. [02:23:31] Speaker B: At BFOP where you can walk up and talk to, you know, anyone from Nikon Cannons. So there's Matt from. [02:23:37] Speaker A: This is, this is the guy that choked Nick out so that he got tricked into buying a GFX100RF. As you can see, there's no quite. Unit. Quite a unit. Yeah, yeah, yeah, you can run. [02:23:50] Speaker D: I, I really want to run that competition again next year and put the broken Sony in the box. [02:23:56] Speaker A: Oh, imagine, imagine. And you can even lead up with it too and be like, you know, I, we can't say what's in the box, but it's pretty exciting to have Leica here this year. Anyway. [02:24:12] Speaker D: There are some running gags at Beef up that just keep giving and this is going to become one. But the one I absolutely love is every year somebody dropped, in fact the same guy last year dropped his camera in the river. He dropped his lens off, off the freaking mountain the year before. So every time someone will drop a lens or a camera and you get to in front of like 500 people go, oh, it's James here. And James, yeah, James, I hear you had a bit of an accident today. And then James tells a story of dropping his camera. And then you go, well, James, we've had a chat to our friends at Nikon and they were horrified to hear about kind of what's happened to your camera. So what they've done is they've all chipped in and we've got you a lens cloth if you want to come and get it. Every time. [02:25:00] Speaker A: It's so brutal. Oh, it's so brutal. But it's so funny. Philip Johnson says, I was in the front row and Matt and Nick's face was, was magic. Yeah, that the, the shock after that impact from the sledgehammer was so good. [02:25:18] Speaker B: I've never seen so many like, yeah, expressions on people and then everyone's, oh, no, like it really happened. I don't think anyone expected it to actually really happen. [02:25:30] Speaker A: I did. I was ready for it. I did not move. I took those photos and I was like, this is happening. It's unfolding. I, I don't know why. I just, I guess I was just naive. I was like, oh, yeah, so this is happening. [02:25:39] Speaker B: Yeah, this is what they do around here. [02:25:42] Speaker A: Tim Siama says, okay, Nick, lay it down for me. What's the, the legal way I can get into BE this year, short of becoming a US citizen, I, I, I. [02:25:51] Speaker D: Think short of sleeping with Matt, you're, you're out of luck this year. [02:25:56] Speaker B: Tim offered to at the Beef up day, but, you know, maybe Matt said no. [02:26:01] Speaker C: I would just arrive with a harvest vest, a ladder and you'll get into anything with those three items. [02:26:09] Speaker A: That's right. Just, just pretend you're fixing a split system or something. [02:26:12] Speaker C: They won't know how to take photos. Yeah, yeah. Matt and Nick sent me down. [02:26:20] Speaker A: Yeah. So it is. There is a waiting list, I think of people because there's been, I've noticed there's a few people saying, hey, life's changed, I can't, I won't be able to use my ticket this year. But I think there's already quite a substantial waiting list. [02:26:31] Speaker D: Yeah, I think we've got 70 odd people on the waiting list. I think we've got, we're just, we're just working through the instructor numbers and particularly how we can manage the evenings. And if we can bring like another 20 people on we will but I think it'll be that sort of number. And then we do get quite a lot of cancellations kind of beforehand. But you're probably only talking about 20 or so where people just can't make it. Yeah, yeah. [02:26:59] Speaker C: How many, how many total tickets are. [02:27:00] Speaker D: There or was there so the moment we sold. 550. [02:27:04] Speaker C: Yeah. And then there was obviously industry and, and lots of, you know. Yeah, probably an extra. [02:27:11] Speaker A: Hey Greg, we haven't booked our accommodation yet. [02:27:14] Speaker B: What? [02:27:16] Speaker A: By we I mean I haven't booked your accommodation yet. We were gonna get a house but. [02:27:22] Speaker B: I'm actually in the van with Justin. [02:27:24] Speaker A: Yeah, I was gonna say I've been looking at some larger tents that I'll. I might be able to sit you up a nice tent which is no problem because it's not cold in Bright. [02:27:33] Speaker B: I will sleep with Matt Crummons to avoid sleeping in a tent. [02:27:36] Speaker A: No, I better get onto that. I think we might be getting close to being out of luck if they've been snapping up all the accommodation around town. [02:27:43] Speaker D: But I keep saying every year if you want to go to Bright, just buy the tickets when they go on sale because they always sell out. [02:27:48] Speaker B: Yeah. [02:27:49] Speaker A: You got to get onto it quick and you got to just trust like don't wait to see who the instructors are or anything that never. You're never going to be able to. It's just there's so many instructors. There's something for everyone. What else am I going to ask you about bfop? [02:28:03] Speaker B: Well, I wanted to ask about beef up days. So a couple of months back we had or you guys organized the first beef up day that was outside of the beef up weekend and you paired that up with the Camera House 40th birthday celebrations. Yet another phenomenal day. What was that? You know, was that a success for you guys? And is that something that you're now contemplating doing more of to facilitate some of those people on waiting lists? [02:28:30] Speaker D: It was, it was, it was a success in that everyone had a lot of fun, including us. It was a commercial disaster. I think it cost us 1500 dollars to run the day because we failed to appreciate the trains weren't going to be running and we need to hire a bus. And we also worked out it cost more to ensure that event than the whole festival. Go figure. [02:28:52] Speaker A: Oh man. Through the same, through the same company like in. [02:28:58] Speaker D: They wouldn't cover it so we had. [02:28:59] Speaker A: To go with something else. [02:29:01] Speaker D: Yeah, it was a, it was a. Yeah, but it was, it was super fun and, and I think, you know, part of the problem is just bandwidth from Matt and I to do this stuff. It's only us doing it. Both he and I have day jobs, so it's, it's pretty hard. I think we'll probably end up doing another one of these after beef. Another one of those after beef. But. [02:29:25] Speaker A: Yeah. [02:29:27] Speaker D: Sorry, you go. [02:29:28] Speaker A: Oh, I was just gonna. No, you say. But there's always been these rumors about tfop, the Tasmania Festival of Photography of some sort because there's so many. [02:29:37] Speaker D: Hopefully Cam Blake's still listening. Hey, he was gonna, he was gonna run TFOP and then discovered and I think Kovid got in the way. But it is. Yeah, like they are. Like the economics of the festival is kind of. It's better now, but certainly like the first few years it's really hard to do it and even break even and the organization. I mean Matt's just been a. I mean he is a dick, but he's a. Been a godsend to have along and you know, he does all of the hard work and he's guy provides a structure and he's a marketing genius and he's a little energizer bunny and like it would not be anywhere near the festival. It is without him. But even with him, it's just an enormous amount of work for me. I, I suspect if I was a full time photographer we would do more of these events, but I'm a bit of a handbrake on it at the moment. [02:30:36] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, it's fair enough. I can't imagine the amount of work that it is in the lead up, let alone watching the weekend from. From my safe distance of behind a camera and lens. It just looked like so much work. But I loved that you guys were still able to have a good time in the evenings, like there was a moment where you had a chance to chat to people and just hang out. It wasn't like. I'm sure there was still stuff swirling around your head that needed to be sorted out, but it was good to see that you at least had a minute to like to chill out and enjoy the fun for an hour or so and then I guess get back to work. But it just seemed like so much going on at once. [02:31:15] Speaker D: Yeah, sort of. Some. Some of you have to be quite organized about like the workshops, but like scarily often we'll be there on the Thursday going, all right, now what are we going to do on Saturday evening? Literally? Well, what are we going to do? [02:31:30] Speaker A: What's, what's, what's the schedule? How do we, how do we make. [02:31:32] Speaker D: Yeah, what are the games we're going to play? And you think that's like two, two and a half hours, three hours of entertainment? We haven't properly thought about it until Thursday. [02:31:43] Speaker A: Speaking of entertainment, I think. I can't remember if this was the Friday or the Saturday night, but this is the sort of thing Nick's talking about when they say, what games are we going to play? A giant. [02:31:54] Speaker B: 500 people strong, 500 person. [02:31:57] Speaker A: 70S themed game of volleyball with an average age of probably 56. I don't know. It's somewhere in there, approximately. And was an absolute hoot. [02:32:13] Speaker B: Yeah. [02:32:13] Speaker A: So, yeah, it was. Yeah. [02:32:16] Speaker D: What I love is I've. I've told Matt when he started, I'd say things like, oh, you know, well, we should hire a lion, or, you know, we do something outright. And Matt would be like, dough. Don't be stupid, we can't do that. And we've got to make sure we actually don't end up paying to run this festival. And now he rang me the other day going, I just want to do a spreadsheet to work out how much money we. We're going to have. And I was like, oh, why? We know it'll probably be fine. He's like, yeah, yeah, but I think, I think we can spend some more money on. Good. We hide. We hired a helicopter. Have you heard the story of the bloody helicopter? No, no, no. So we, we came up, we were going to do this competition and we said, oh, we should give something cool away. We said, oh, and we'll give away a, like an aerial flight over Feathertop, like at, at sunset, you know, in a plane or a helicopter. So we sort of did all of that. And then I had, I had the role to get a helicopter and I have actually had a helicopter before, so I knew, you know, it's 800 bucks an hour, something like that. No, no. I had to hire the world's Most expensive helicopter. $2,800 an hour. [02:33:31] Speaker A: What was it? Bell Jet Ranger or something? [02:33:35] Speaker D: That's exactly what it was. It was like a 2 in engine. Like. [02:33:38] Speaker B: Yeah, like an exact level, kind of. [02:33:40] Speaker A: Yeah. Leather seats. [02:33:42] Speaker D: Not. [02:33:42] Speaker A: Not a, not a stinky little R44. No, no, no doors on it. Wow, that's. That's awesome. But not very profitable, which is classic. A couple of good comments here. Craig Murphy says T flop. Sorry, Cam. Elena picking on my word choices. Hoot leaning into that average age. Yeah, I've gotta. I've gotta age up a little bit for the. The BFOP crowd. So Hoot comes into my vocab and Philip Johnson has a question. Nick, is Mika Boynton and Matt Palmer attending this year? [02:34:25] Speaker D: Mika's. Yeah, Mika's running some workshops. Matt's looking after the. After the gallery. Yeah, but you're welcome. [02:34:34] Speaker A: You can't have both. [02:34:35] Speaker D: Yeah, they normally do something so you can go up and have like a glass of wine or whatever in their gallery or something. [02:34:41] Speaker B: I think last year they were both away on their honeymoon. [02:34:43] Speaker D: Yeah. Yeah. They never stopped blaming me for that. I had this. I had this issue where they told me they were away getting. They actually got married in my place and then went over on. On honeymoon and they were sort of like, when. When are you doing vop? We had this one weekend which I think was a weekend ahead of when we actually held it, but my kids went to the World Roller Hockey Championships and it was going to overlap and I had to move it and they still haven't forgiven me. [02:35:10] Speaker A: Ah, well, you got. [02:35:11] Speaker B: I mean, we'll see him this year and be good to check out the gallery too because I've never been in. It's beautiful. Was it open last. Last year? Justin, did you go in? [02:35:22] Speaker A: Not during be, but I've been back there since. Since. Yeah. We go to pass through Bright or too Bright pretty regularly. So yeah, it's great. [02:35:31] Speaker D: There's a whole lot of the instructors who've got sort of galleries knocking around. Bright because you got. Charlie's got one over in Mount Beauty. Jp. I don't know. He's still got one. He had one for a little while, so Jesse's got one, so. [02:35:48] Speaker A: Oh yeah. [02:35:49] Speaker D: You can do like a tour of the beef up instructors, galleries. [02:35:52] Speaker A: I might have to do that. Do a little midweek trip in the lead up to beef up sometime and just, Just do a gallery tour and. And go and annoy them all. What was I going to say? Okay, this is completely sorry for the, you know, the live listeners and the people listening later. This won't interest you guys at all, but what day should we come over, Nick? When? Because we, like, we want to have a good weekend. We won't have time. Can we help set up or anything? [02:36:20] Speaker D: Oh, yeah, definitely. [02:36:21] Speaker A: What day? [02:36:21] Speaker D: What Come and help. I mean, we. Matt and I normally get there on the Wednesday night. We've actually. One of the things we're going to do this year. Oh, Matt's gonna kill me for telling this stuff, but you remember we had the bus trip on the Friday and the Saturday. [02:36:36] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah. [02:36:37] Speaker D: We're actually going to run the bus trip on the Thursday and the Friday. So some people come up a whole day early and do the bus trip. [02:36:45] Speaker B: So that's part of a ticketed workshop, isn't it? [02:36:48] Speaker D: Yeah, that's right. So, I mean, that was a super. I mean, I didn't do it, but they, they. There's two instructors. Take that. So Brendan and Charlie take that. [02:36:58] Speaker A: Yeah. [02:36:59] Speaker D: And they sort of do a grand tour of the mountains. The downside is you have to listen to Charlie banging on for 12 hours. But beyond, beyond that, the photographic opportunities are quite good. But that's, that's a sort of, you know, a whole day thing. And what we found is people really wanted to do that but then couldn't do any other workshops. So we said, look, we move it at least. So Friday's only a half day. Thursdays, there's nothing on. We can do. We can do that. But I would, I would, you know, come up the. On the Thursday sometime. We do a lot of the setting up on the Thursday night. And there's Nikon, who I absolutely adore because they're, I mean, such good sponsors. They put on dinner and beers for all of the instructors and all of the brands buying. Yeah, they're buying dinner for Canon. [02:37:49] Speaker B: That's a good power play, actually. [02:37:50] Speaker A: I was going to say that's a big dick move. I love that. Yeah. What would you like to eat there, Canon people? The fish or the chicken? That's a big dick move. I love it. Can I get you a beer? Would you say that Nikon have helped set the tone for how the rest of the camera brands interact on the, on the weekend? You know, like, they've sort of established the, the mix of fun and involved and, and professionalism, like that kind of mix that happens up there. [02:38:25] Speaker D: Yeah. Nikon got it really quickly and Julie Kimpton's kind of a big bit of that because she's like a little fun machine. But I always, it always sort of occurs to me it's pretty scary for these brands. You know you kind of think of some of the stuff we get up to and you know there's real risk of brand, brand damage to them but they, they play along and. No, they absolutely get it. And I just love, I mean I always sort of blows my mind that anyone can walk in and go can I borrow that 25, 000 lens and that six thousand, seven thousand dollar body and can I have that six thousand dollar lens over there and see ya. And yeah, that, that's pretty much all that occurs. [02:39:15] Speaker A: They take your name. I got the R1. They took my name and phone number I think but I gave them a fake number. [02:39:22] Speaker B: They let you take it over. [02:39:23] Speaker A: I was said my name was custom Jassals and, and wandered off with an R1. And yeah, that. No, they, they're, it's, they're very generous in the way that they loan gear. Like they, I didn't, I saw the R1, I was playing with it and they were like just take it. And I was like no, no, no, like someone might want to actually like I'm probably not going to buy it. I've got an R3, I don't think I'm gonna upgrade. Someone might actually want to, you know, take it on a sports workshop or something that's interested in it. They're like no, no, take it. I'm like okay, all right, see you. [02:39:55] Speaker B: They're all down to earth too. They're all just, you know, they're all up for a chat about what's going on about the, you know, about gear, craft like all of them really down to earth. [02:40:03] Speaker A: No, I'm kidding. We won't name. [02:40:07] Speaker D: No, sorry. [02:40:09] Speaker A: The only, the only brand that wasn't as, as involved with it I think were just short staffed. [02:40:15] Speaker D: They just, Sony got called because they turned up with like two people and it was. [02:40:19] Speaker A: Yeah, they turned workshops. [02:40:21] Speaker B: I think they went on one of the bus tours. So they disappeared as well for a day. [02:40:25] Speaker A: Yeah, I think they just had, they didn't have the resources to engage the way the other brands were engaging. Whereas the other brands have got, they've got engineers, instructors, they've got people for the booth, they've got tech cannonball techs. They're like doing sensor cleans all weekend. [02:40:39] Speaker C: Clever like. Yeah, cleaned, yeah. You know, showing up for the people and then yeah. [02:40:49] Speaker D: Yeah. [02:40:49] Speaker B: Simple little things, though, aren't they? But they. They make a huge difference to the energy and what people experience at the event. So. [02:40:57] Speaker A: And whether. And, and, and. And that you've invested in. In a system that has support and people behind it and real people. You know, like a lot of people haven't had a lot of interaction with anyone from the brand that they've probably spent 30 to $100,000 with. You know, because you sort of. You might deal with a camera store or whatever, and you haven't necessarily like hung out with someone from that brand before and. Yeah. Gives you that opportunity. Anyway. Hey, you've been now beat Matt by 15 minutes. Episode length. [02:41:31] Speaker D: Amazing. [02:41:32] Speaker A: Not even. Not even a minute, but 15 of them. [02:41:35] Speaker D: Yep. [02:41:37] Speaker A: Anything else that you want to talk about in terms of anything? [02:41:41] Speaker D: Probably. I've probably disclosed that David Clutterbuck has been saying what great guy I am and what clown Matt is, is actually my alter ego. So just so we're clear on that. That's been me commenting on me throughout the. [02:41:55] Speaker A: I feel like you could have leant into that a little bit harder. I would have liked to see some. You should have. [02:41:59] Speaker D: Really. [02:42:00] Speaker A: Yeah. [02:42:00] Speaker D: I was going to start off with the whole, you haven't even touched a GFX 100 RF. How can you possibly comment on it? [02:42:09] Speaker A: Yeah, I think that could have gotten good. I really like that name. Damn it. I thought we had a new subscriber. Can you. Can you at least subscribe anyway so that we get another subscriber? Yeah. [02:42:23] Speaker D: Wow. [02:42:25] Speaker A: All right, so we'll come up. We'll come up on the Thursday. It's going to be great. [02:42:29] Speaker D: And obviously you've got to be the. You, You. You got to be at the party. I mean, the party is. To me, the. The instructor thing on the Sunday night is just my favorite part of the whole event. Just because. That was pretty cool. Relax. [02:42:41] Speaker A: That was so good. [02:42:42] Speaker B: Yeah. [02:42:43] Speaker A: That was so good. Yeah, I kind of taking Jim. I probably would. So your wedding's on this. On the Saturday. Where is it? [02:42:52] Speaker C: I don't know. Bendigo, probably. [02:42:53] Speaker A: Okay. You sure they're not thinking about splitting up? [02:43:00] Speaker C: Yeah, it's at Bendigo. It's at home. [02:43:02] Speaker A: It's at Bendigo. Okay. So you would have to. Yeah. Horror helicopter. I mean, 2,800 an hour. [02:43:11] Speaker C: Yeah. [02:43:11] Speaker A: It. They probably won't slide it into the budget, but. No, and neither will we. [02:43:16] Speaker C: You could media sponsor them. [02:43:20] Speaker A: You're not that important to get a chopper up, but you could drive up. I'll cover your fuel. [02:43:28] Speaker D: Jump on your 450 cross country, right? [02:43:32] Speaker A: Oh, imagine now that's a video. Like, I've got to get back to bfop and you do it on the dirt bike on unsealed roads only. [02:43:40] Speaker D: Yeah. You have to carry it if he's on tarmac. [02:43:43] Speaker B: No pressure. [02:43:49] Speaker A: Yeah, you should. You should come. The Sunday night was really cool, but I'll make it happen. That'd be a bit of a mission. [02:43:55] Speaker C: I'll come Thursday, Friday and Sunday. [02:43:58] Speaker A: Okay, then I do that. I do need to get your room then. All right. Because I was like, if he's only here for the Friday night, he can probably just rooftop tent it. [02:44:07] Speaker B: Justin, can you add it to the top of your to do list on your whiteboard, please? Because we really need somewhere to actually stay. [02:44:15] Speaker C: Look, I'm happy to sleep in my tent. Justin, you can sleep in the van and we'll just. We'll get a swag. [02:44:19] Speaker A: What about Greg? You got a swag? [02:44:23] Speaker B: I don't have a swag. What do you mean? [02:44:25] Speaker D: Camp. [02:44:25] Speaker B: What is this? Camping. [02:44:27] Speaker A: Camping City boy. Cool. What else? Anything else? Camp at Nick's. Yeah, we should. [02:44:35] Speaker B: It's a beautiful property. It's a beautiful, beautiful property. Yeah, it is absolutely stunning. [02:44:40] Speaker A: It's insane. [02:44:41] Speaker B: Yeah, I remember arriving the first morning for. I think it was. [02:44:47] Speaker A: Food photography. [02:44:49] Speaker B: Yeah, no, it was like product photography with. Oh, yeah, Emily. That was the first time I met her and she's been on the show. You can check out her episode, folks. But yeah, arriving up there because she drove me up the hill from the. Where the bus. Because the bus couldn't get all the way up and just. Yeah. Getting out of the car and walking around the house and then looking up that. The rest of the valley up to the mountain. Oh, just. Yeah. Awe inspiring. Really amazing. [02:45:16] Speaker A: This amazing cracker of a spot and then all the fires and you're just hanging out outside with photographers everywhere. Half of them can barely stand up because they've just done workshops back to back for days and days. Yeah. [02:45:28] Speaker D: Had a few beers. [02:45:30] Speaker A: Had a few beers. [02:45:32] Speaker D: Yeah. [02:45:33] Speaker B: Yeah. [02:45:34] Speaker A: Cool. [02:45:35] Speaker B: All right, well, should we call it a day? [02:45:38] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. [02:45:39] Speaker B: We've beaten Matt Crummins from a time. [02:45:42] Speaker A: I'm sure Nick's probably got actual work to do. Are you at work at the moment? You home? [02:45:46] Speaker D: No, no, no. I've got to shoot off. I'm hosting a dinner tonight, actually. Got to get into town. [02:45:51] Speaker A: All right. [02:45:52] Speaker D: All right. [02:45:53] Speaker C: Do you need to ask your question, Justin? [02:45:56] Speaker A: Which question? Oh, yeah, okay. Yeah, sorry. We always ask everyone, what if it was the end of the world? Zombie apocalypse. All the beef op attendees had turned into zombies and were coming at you and Matt slowly but hungrily. What one camera and lens or camera integrated lens would you choose to document the befop zombie apocalypse end of the world? [02:46:24] Speaker D: I feel a Z9 and a 14 mil wide angle lens. Blood on the lens. [02:46:34] Speaker A: I love that you just, you just want to get in close and have them coming right at you. Okay. Yeah. [02:46:40] Speaker B: You could blind them with that strobe. So you know. [02:46:42] Speaker A: Yeah. And an Allen crumb, Max. Yeah. [02:46:48] Speaker C: 12 Allen crumbs. [02:46:50] Speaker D: Yeah. [02:46:53] Speaker A: Max. [02:46:53] Speaker B: Add that to the T shirt list. Look on that note. On that note folks, we are going to call it a day. It has been a long episode but a thoroughly, thoroughly entertaining and enjoying one enjoyable one. Thank you to Nick Fletcher for joining us today. Yeah, incredible story and I love the fact that you constantly say that you, you know, you never felt like you were a very good photographer but you just kept pushing forward with your craft and, and look at you now. You're running probably the best photography workshop in the world. You know that that creates a lot of energy and a lot of buzz and I think that's something especially to be proud of because there's not a lot of those sorts of events left. You know, we used to have trade shows and we used to have big, big photography events and they all disappeared with COVID I mean they were already starting to struggle with the rise of the Internet age. But I think that you guys have done an amazing job in keeping Beef Up Alive through Covid as well. And you know, it's now the talk of the town when you speak to any local photographer and clearly people are queuing up still to get in even though tickets are all sold. So congratulations on that front. Just a reminder to everyone watching along, listening along, whether you're live with us now or you catch up with us later, please make sure you give us a like. It helps out a lot. And subscribe to the channel. Hit the bell icon so you get notifications of any regular episodes as well as the surprise ones we throw in from time to time. And speaking of which, we, we run two shows a week. We have a Monday evening random photography show, 7.30pm Australian Eastern Standard Time. So you can do the conversion on that. And then obviously our Thursday morning show where we interview an amazing photographer like we've done today and that's at 9 00am Australian Eastern Standard Time every single Thursday. But yeah, and also the show today has been brought to you by Lucky straps head to Luckystraps.com we make premium, premium leather camera straps right here in Australia. And we'll show them to you pretty. [02:49:04] Speaker A: Much sometimes even for the best. [02:49:06] Speaker B: Yeah. [02:49:08] Speaker A: There ever is and ever was. [02:49:10] Speaker B: You made them for Fuji. I didn't know that. [02:49:14] Speaker A: But. [02:49:14] Speaker B: But, but, yeah. Once again, thanks, Jim, for joining today. Great to see you as always. Thank you, Justin, for paying for the Internet bill. But, yeah, once again, thanks, Nick Fletcher for. Do you want to say some goodbyes? Who's putting up all the codes on the bloody screen? [02:49:34] Speaker A: Jim. Jim's trying to get his code out there. It's. Yeah. Anyway, just everyone knows these codes. You can use code Jim or Greg or Justin for 15 off. It doesn't get us anything. We're not like influencers where they get a cut of it. It's just a competition we've got going on. And Jim's currently winning because his name's the shortest and it's easy to type in. [02:49:54] Speaker B: I think. [02:49:55] Speaker C: I think last week's code. Thanks. Paul's actually winning. [02:49:58] Speaker A: It is. He said God is more than any of them. All right, so finally, thanks Philip Johnson for joining us. He's looking forward to beef up. Paul Henderson. Great show. Gotta run. Thanks, guys. He says Craig Murphy says yes, please. I need to get back to work. Brendan Waits says I've really got to start closing the shop on Thursday mornings because he's from camera and photo down along the Great Ocean Road. Late again. We'll watch this back. You better watch it back. And that's it. Thanks to everybody else that has been commenting and chatting away, especially you guys from overseas. Tim Ciamis, sorry you won't make it to B. Ha. No, you're on the wait list. You might. Yeah, everybody. Especially our new Twitch. Twitch guy. Maple Glades. Okay. [02:50:43] Speaker C: Thanks, Nick. [02:50:44] Speaker D: Thanks, guys. Everybody, thanks. [02:50:45] Speaker A: Thank you. [02:50:46] Speaker B: Bye, everybody.