EP90 | A Lifetime of Photography with Rodney Nicholson

[00:00:03] Speaker A: Got to do the Camera Life shuffle. [00:00:13] Speaker B: It's got the moves. [00:00:17] Speaker C: I always laugh at this. [00:00:22] Speaker A: Well, good morning everybody and welcome to the Camera Life podcast. It is Thursday 19th June 2025 and this is episode 90 of the camera Life podcast, proudly brought to you by Lucky Straps, makers of amazing premium leather camera straps from Bendigo, Victoria. And we're joined today by Lucky Straps founder and all round cannon shooter Justin Cassels. And we're joined by Jim. How are you, Jim? [00:00:53] Speaker D: Just, just Jim. [00:00:55] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:00:56] Speaker B: You shoot Nikon so you don't get, you don't get an intro like that. [00:00:58] Speaker A: No accolades for you, my friend. [00:01:00] Speaker B: Sorry, sorry. [00:01:01] Speaker A: But of course we do have a guest. Being a Thursday morning, we do have a guest on Today and we, we are, we are graced with the presence of someone who's been walking around with a camera in his hand for well over 50 years now. It's actually 51 years this year. And we're joined by Rodney Nicholson. G' day, Rodney. [00:01:18] Speaker C: Good morning. Morning, Rodney. [00:01:21] Speaker A: Thanks for coming on the show. [00:01:22] Speaker C: Ah, great to be here. I love your show, it's fantastic. [00:01:26] Speaker B: We love seeing in the chat. It's so much fun when you jump in. [00:01:29] Speaker A: Yep. Hey, so for those of you watching and listening along at loan. Gosh, I lost words already. For those of you watching or listening, this is the Camera Life podcast. Please make sure you give us a like on this episode. Do it now. Just get out of the way. And it helps us out a lot. But also make sure you subscribe because we do two shows a week. We do a 9am Thursday morning Australian Eastern Standard Time show and we do a 7:30pm show on a Monday evening, again, Strand and Eastern Standard Time. And this coming Monday we actually have a very special show coming up. We've got a panel podcast with three of our past guests, all very accomplished photographers and they're going to join us to talk about why we shoot film in the digital age. So be sure to like subscribe. Hit the notification bell so you get notifications of that episode before it goes live. And we look forward to seeing you. [00:02:26] Speaker B: In the chat because if you are new and you haven't, haven't, can't tell, all of our podcasts are live. That's how we do it. That's how we like to do it here. So we live stream whether we're with a guest or if we're just chopping it up on a Monday night. And you can jump in the chat and participate, ask questions, tell us things, give us your opinion. That's how we like to roll. [00:02:46] Speaker A: Yeah. And last Monday night we had our first cool call in Listener. Just like a radio show, folks. Yeah, I'm actually scouring in the 90s, we are living. I'm actually scouring ebay for an old like audio desk for Justin, even if it's dead, just so he has the toy to play with, like he's a radio host. [00:03:05] Speaker B: One right here I've got a beautiful little roadcaster. [00:03:08] Speaker A: I want one of those big boxy retro ones. [00:03:11] Speaker B: A big retro desk. I actually there's someone in Bendigo selling an on air light box but they want 100 bucks for it and I'm like, it'd be pretty cool. What, we just alternate who has it. [00:03:25] Speaker A: Yeah, we'll do it, we'll set up an arrangement. Yeah, you have it on the weekends, I'll have it on weekdays, you know, that sort of thing. Anyway, enough about us. Let's talk about Rodney Nicholson. Rodney, thanks so much for joining us today, really appreciate it. We'd love to hear, we're going to hear all of your story. We're going to go back a very, very long way obviously. But before we do, can you just give us a quick 60 minute clip of, of who you are and. [00:03:51] Speaker B: 60 minutes. [00:03:53] Speaker A: 60 minutes. [00:03:53] Speaker B: No, 60 seconds, just a quick six. [00:03:55] Speaker A: Sorry, just a quick 60 minute summary. Now just give us the short, the short and sweet version of who you are and what you do. [00:04:04] Speaker C: Yeah, sure, look, you know, I guess Mum inspired me photographically with her box brownie. You know, taking all the family photos, the Christmas presents, the da da da. She was always bouncing around and I was a pretty well into into skin diving and surfing at the time. So I eventually lay by my own camera after drowning one of my mum's box brownies. I'll get to that later. And yeah, so like from. I was born in Williamstown, grew up in a boat shed, you know, fished the pier, surfed on shore. Willie and the surfing bug got hold of me and I moved to point Lonsdale in 1974 and lay by my first Pentex way back then, 400 mil lens and an Appendix SP 500. And yeah, mainly, you know, I got into photography to take surfing photos and so, yeah, and having a camera, I was a young, you know, surfy bum, love music, the Eagles, doobies, all that sort of stuff. So we'd go off to festival hall, pay our seven bucks for a ticket and my friends wouldn't see me all night because I'd take the 50 mil lens and the Spotmatic, go up front and as always, because the first two rows were for corporates and there was always a couple of seats left. So Roger would plonk his cameras on one, sit on the other and spend the night shooting Joan Armor trading or eagles or doobies. And the end of the night I go back in with my friends and say, where you been? I said, mate, I got the best seat in the house. [00:05:40] Speaker A: Oh, wow. [00:05:41] Speaker C: So like, you know, photography blossomed, like, you know, music and surfing. Pretty much. So, yeah. And it's still pretty. [00:05:50] Speaker A: Pretty wholesome pursuits when you think about it. [00:05:53] Speaker C: Absolutely. Well, you know, I mean, yeah, both passionate sort of endeavors. So I'm pretty. Pretty blessed. Pretty blessed, you know. [00:06:03] Speaker A: Well, thank you for sharing that little snippet. I did ask for 60 minutes, but I'll deal with the 60s. We'll accept the 60 second version. We will dive into your story in a bit more detail. But first of all, it's a couple of quick warnings in the chat. [00:06:15] Speaker B: Justin, there's a few in the chat. There's a lot of people watching live too. So if you're listening live, jump in the chat, let us know where you're from. You doing. [00:06:22] Speaker C: Who are you? [00:06:23] Speaker A: Where you from? What do you shoot with? [00:06:25] Speaker B: Morning. Philip Johnson. Good to see you. Wookie in the chat. Morning, Chili. Chilly. [00:06:32] Speaker A: Yeah, very chilly. [00:06:33] Speaker B: Ian Thompson. Ian Thompson also. Good morning, gents. Good morning, Ian. [00:06:37] Speaker A: Hey, Ian. [00:06:38] Speaker C: Morning. [00:06:39] Speaker B: It is. It's chilly here in Bendigo, that's for sure. [00:06:42] Speaker A: Yeah, it's. It's. It's cold here, Rodney. For those of you watching or listening, Rodney has an open fireplace behind him, so he's more than. More than catered for. [00:06:53] Speaker B: Wow, man, that's the best background ever. Yeah, that's delightful. [00:06:58] Speaker C: Yeah, Gamble's all around shortly. [00:07:02] Speaker A: Nice. You make me jealous. [00:07:05] Speaker B: And we've also got the. We've got the California crew in the house. David Moscaro and then the other David, the drunk wedding photographer. Moshi moshi. Good to see you guys as well. [00:07:15] Speaker A: Hey, guys. [00:07:18] Speaker B: Senior US Correspondence. Apparently it's very hot in la. Yeah, nice. That sounds nice. Mind flying over there? [00:07:29] Speaker A: All right, let's. Rodney, let's roll back the clock a little bit. You briefly mentioned earlier your mom being a key inspiration for you and. And her capturing a lot with her box brownie, I think, you know, we talked about a photo earlier, which I might just bring up quickly because I think it's a good time to bring up this image. Just bear with us, guys. Where'd she go? There she is. Oh, no, she isn't. There she is. So this is a photo of your mum standing in front of what we discussed, what we decided was a petrol drum on a pier with a Box Brownie in a hand. Talk to us about how your mum in. Inspired your own creativity. [00:08:17] Speaker C: I guess the joy that she got out of, you know, pointing the Box Brownie at every different occasion that come our way. And it was sort of probably just an unconscious thing for me to. Well, initially that's. That photo there is probably my first photograph because I said, mom, you never in any photographs. So that's all the kids at holidays at the caravan park at Queen's Cliff. So, you know, I took the box brown and then I enjoyed the Box Brownie. So was probably her love of it and her enthusiasm that got me into it and you know, like that, you know, that sort of looking through the viewfinder, smile, boys, landscape. You got to do that as well. We used to go like this buggerizing around and you have to sort of jiggle it around to get the perspective right, you know. [00:09:21] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:09:22] Speaker C: Well, in the end I borrowed that to take surfing photographs and I put. Put this in an ice cream container, put the lid on it, paddle out the back of the wave, sit on my board like that and watch the guys catch waves and shoot. But because it was too far away, the focal length was, you know, it was too small. So silly, me paddles in closer to get the action and. Well, one and only time I went over the falls with the Box Brownie in my hand and the boys all laugh because I come up like this from the bottom of the ocean with the camera above my head, put it in the box and went home with my tail between my legs to tell my mum I drowned. The Box Brownie. [00:10:08] Speaker A: Yes. How'd that go? [00:10:10] Speaker C: Oh, no, Mum was super, you know, she was just the best woman. Super forgiving, super loving, you know. Yeah. You know, I remember early days in Queens of looking at the bomby breaking out at Point Lonsdale and saying, mum, I want to go and surf out there. And like, you know, no problem to her to walk all the way out and sit on the wall and watch me surfing. So, yeah, no, no drywood. I brought her another one. I forget how much it cost, but I wasn't. I was an apprentice carpenter. And so, you know, it was probably a whole pay packet, a week's pay packet, but which wasn't a lot of money back in the 70s. [00:10:49] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:10:49] Speaker B: Can you make. [00:10:50] Speaker A: You made things right. I said you made things right. [00:10:55] Speaker C: Absolutely. [00:10:58] Speaker B: Geez, we're, we're on on point today, Greg, aren't we? We'll get there. No, I was going to ask because I don't know a lot about the box, Brandy. It's this iconic camera. I think I've even got one in my house somewhere that doesn't work floating around. But I'm shame to say I don't even know what focal length it is. Like. Can you tell me about that camera? [00:11:18] Speaker C: Not a lot. I should know a lot about it. But it's a roll film, 120 roll film and. And like 620 and I've lost the spools in the back of mine, but there's a couple of spools in there and when you roll frame to frame, it shows you a number in that. You see that little red icon there? [00:11:41] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:11:42] Speaker C: The number comes up. I think it was 10 frames per roll. Roll on, on the side and shoot and then it rolls itself back in. It's a bit similar to 120 roll film of today. And you lick the back and take it to your chemist and he processes it. That's an original. That's the original box brownie shot, so. [00:12:04] Speaker B: Oh, really? [00:12:05] Speaker C: That's what you get in your packet from Coford, the chemist or whoever you take it to. [00:12:12] Speaker B: Was it? So is it fully automatic? You just point and point and shoot? Press the button. [00:12:16] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. And you know, you've sort of got to hold the sunlight out. Mum would be always going like this, getting the sun, which is typical of what we can do today sometimes. So, you know, it was those similar principles in a very manual fashion. [00:12:36] Speaker A: Through. [00:12:37] Speaker C: The lens, sort of bang. A lot of the photos I've got of mums are overexposed. A lot of them are the best black and white you could. You couldn't print as good a black and white asset. So a bit of hit and miss. But again, like the old Pentax manuals, you learn how to, you know, match the needle. Overexposed, underexposed to get that perfect exposure. Basic stuff, but still a learned thing, you know. [00:13:03] Speaker A: Yeah. Yep. [00:13:04] Speaker D: Cool. [00:13:05] Speaker A: Very cool. So. So your mum obviously was a keen supporter of. Of, I imagine everything you did, whether it be surfing or going out exploring your local world or. Or indeed photography. What did she, what. What sort of encouragement or guidance did she give you about the images that you were taking at the time? In the early days, obviously. [00:13:33] Speaker C: She would get them for Christmas presents. So she had a wall of my work. But. But yeah, look, I think Mum would encourage me no matter what. You know, it's. I left home, I Left home as soon as I could because I just had to be by the water. But every Sunday I'd go around to Queenscliff. My mum was in Willie but they had a caravan in Queenscliff so roast was always on on Sunday so I was going home for a roast every Sunday. So you know, I can't recall her. She was just very proud, you know I, I was rummaging through. This has really got me rummaging through a whole lot of stuff. And I saw some photos of her at my 25th retrospective. You know she was just out of the scenes pouring the beers, working the bar, you know, just, just happy as Larry. And she made me got my cousin who's a sign writer a big sign. Congratulations on 25 years. So yeah, just a very humble, big hearted woman, you know, just yeah, yeah, yeah. I couldn't really do any wrong if I did, I copped her. But we were brought up with, you know, civility cost you nothing. Respect your elders and if you don't succeed, try and try again. So yeah, you know, it was good grounding, you know to, to sort of fall into. So yeah, yeah. [00:15:03] Speaker A: You know it's interesting Rodney, hearing you talk about, you know, heading to Queenscliff to the, you know, for the, to the caravan. There's nothing more Victorian. I think not, maybe not so much nowadays but I remember growing up we would always head down to either Queenscliff or Rock Rosebud or Dramana to hang out at a mate's, you know, caravan in the caravan park in the holidays and it's, it's kind of a quintessential Victorian, you know, growing up, experience of heading down the coast with mates or with family and you've just, you bringing it up then is, is raised all these memories for me about that, that. [00:15:44] Speaker C: Part of the world. [00:15:44] Speaker A: It's, it's such a beautiful area and I think you were very fortunate to grow up there. You know there's a, there's a lot to love about that experience. [00:15:53] Speaker C: So it's a dying experience which is a bit sad, you know what I mean? It's that for sure and thing with the, you know, the you know, the tents and holding down the ropes in storms and just a great upbringing, a great you know, life thing. Now, now there's sort of too many B Bs and bloody, you know, I shouldn't say, you know, softy sort of stuff, you know. [00:16:17] Speaker B: For those, for those listening from overseas, Queenscliff, this, that area, it's sort of further southwest of Melbourne, maybe an hour's drive or so. From Melbourne a little bit, a little bit further. It's just near Torquay, which is one of the iconic surf spots. Surf history with Bell's Beach. So a lot of, you know, surf brands were born in Torquay. Well, you know, world famous surf brands. [00:16:48] Speaker A: Like Oakley, Rip Curl. [00:16:51] Speaker B: Yeah, Rip Curl, Quick Quicksilver. So it's a, it's a super unique area and like Greg said, a sort of a lot of Australiana. Yeah, and iconic photos from the 70s and 80s and 90s. It's, yeah, very, very cool place to grow up. [00:17:11] Speaker C: Yeah, it's, it's the entrance to Port Phillip Bay where all the ships come in and where, where all the Italian migrants and, and, and whatever come in to settle in this country. And you know, like in the 1800s, all the ships that ran aground here in bad weather and, you know, misnavigation and, you know, bringing slates and irons and gooseberries and olives and wines and Saturns, you know, it's like. Yeah, it's a pretty amazing piece of water that. And it's one and seventh of the worst stretches of water in the southern hemisphere at Point Lonzo, Serena I, Port C one side and Queen. Point Lonzo, Queens Griff the other. [00:17:52] Speaker A: Yeah, and, and also, guys, there's a, there's a ferry that runs across between those two points. A car ferry that I remember going across several times. My parents on, on family trips and with friends and even then taking my own kids when they were little across on the ferry just for that experience of, you know, it was, it's, it's a part of Victoria and that region. [00:18:14] Speaker B: So you know what? We're, we're, we're here now. I just want to show everyone. So, all right, we've gone this far. We're going to do a little lesson. So that's Melbourne. This is, this is Victoria. It's not really showing us a good, a good sort of Victoria representation, but yeah, that's Victoria, the state that we're in then. You can see Melbourne down here. Port Phillip Bay. [00:18:36] Speaker A: That's where I am in Melbourne. [00:18:37] Speaker B: Yeah, see that's Greg there, just there. We'll zoom in on him in a minute. [00:18:45] Speaker A: Show everyone where Bendigo is from there, mate. [00:18:47] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, actually that's a good point because that's where we are. So Bendigo is up here, which is sort of Central Victoria. [00:18:53] Speaker D: Hour and a half north of Melbourne. [00:18:55] Speaker B: Hour and a half north of Melbourne. Look, let's just. It gets context. Okay? [00:18:58] Speaker A: Yeah, New Zealand is out there for the flat earthers out there. You can tune out right now. [00:19:04] Speaker B: So we're down south in Australia. South of Australia. We go all the way down here and then Melbourne, and then this is Port Phillip Bay. And then zoom right in all of the water for Port Phillip Bay comes in and out through this little gap just here. And that's the crazy stretch of water. And then if we just go out a little bit, where's. So Bell's beach is here. Ocean Grove, Barwon Heads, Torquay. This is all kind of iconic surf coastline. And for tourists, you would know this. If you've ever heard of the Great Ocean Road and the twelve Apostles and that sort of stuff, that's all along this area here. That's where you'll find our friend Brendan Waitz's shop, Cameron Photo. [00:19:53] Speaker A: And Sam Olson's book is all about that whole photographing. That's the road. [00:19:57] Speaker B: I saw her in the chat. Good morning. [00:19:59] Speaker A: Hey, Sam. [00:20:00] Speaker B: Yeah, so if you want to travel the area and find some great photo spots, check out Sam Olsen's book. [00:20:05] Speaker C: Yeah, Yeah. [00:20:07] Speaker A: I was lucky enough to see a proof of it the other day. We had a video chat and she showed me a proof of it. It's well underway. She's just making some corrections and choosing the best paper stock for. And, yeah, the book is on its way, which is amazing. Wonderful to hear because when Sam joined us for that discussion about it a few months ago, she was wanting to. You know, she was worried about reaching funding goals and now the book is happening. So. We're super proud of you, Sam. Great effort. [00:20:37] Speaker C: Yeah, well done. [00:20:38] Speaker A: It's no mean feat publishing a photo book, let alone an educational one. [00:20:41] Speaker B: So I think it's massive, isn't it? 700 pages or something. [00:20:46] Speaker A: Yeah. She's had to change the paper stock because the original version was like 15 kilos or something, so. It'll be fine. It's like the Bible. It's like the Ten Commandments. [00:20:57] Speaker C: It's. [00:20:58] Speaker A: It's on slate, but great to have you in the chat, Sam dear. [00:21:03] Speaker B: Back to Rodney. [00:21:03] Speaker A: Yeah, we went way off track then, didn't we? That's lovely. [00:21:06] Speaker B: Yeah, we do it. [00:21:07] Speaker A: I love it. I love it. Should we just quickly jump into the chat and. Because the chat's starting to go off, there is a. [00:21:13] Speaker B: Well, look, there's the only things I wanted. So this is a new, new person in the chat. I think Slap wants to know what's boudoir? Because. Because Jim's got that in his little thing that says wedding and boudoir photography. What's boudoir, Jim? [00:21:28] Speaker D: Oh, it's probably too long to explain right now. [00:21:31] Speaker A: Like we got two hours. [00:21:32] Speaker B: It's. It's people with not many clothes on. But it's not, it's not. Well, it's not distasteful. Yeah. [00:21:40] Speaker D: Like the word comes. It's was used to be like a private dressing room. So it's sort of like private room photos is the, the I guess old term where that's kind of come from. [00:21:52] Speaker B: Is it. Is that a French word? Anyone know anyone smarter than me? [00:21:56] Speaker C: I didn't know that. [00:21:57] Speaker A: I didn't know that it referred to like a place where you privately change. [00:22:01] Speaker D: Like a private room. [00:22:02] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. [00:22:03] Speaker D: So the Google says photographic style featuring intimate, sensual, romantic and sometimes erotic images of its subjects in a photography studio, bedroom or private dressing room primarily intended for private enjoyment of the subjects or their romantic partners. [00:22:24] Speaker A: I glad you know what you're doing, Jim. [00:22:26] Speaker B: That answers. So I'll just Google what it is. [00:22:30] Speaker A: A wedding. [00:22:31] Speaker B: A wedding is apparently, I believe, two people. No, Pete Mellow says good to explain. Yeah, it is, it is Pete. It's one of those things that's easier to explain with a photo and you just say that's boudoir photography. And they'd be like, oh yeah, I get that. Good morning, Pete Mellows. Good morning, Nev Clark. Nev Clark says an hour and a half drive. That's a milk and bread one run in wa. Yeah, we're not, we're not all from the great big wa. Nev's been down to the Mornington Peninsula area. Absolutely loved it. A bit of golf, stunning part of the world. Yeah. You need to get over to the other side and capture great Ocean Road. [00:23:09] Speaker A: With Come visit us. [00:23:11] Speaker B: Nev. Sam's book. Sam says shit. I'm sure I've heard something about that region. [00:23:15] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:23:15] Speaker B: And RXA Photography's in the chat. Good morning. Lucinda's in the chat. Good morning. It's. It's love to see you all here. Yeah, you know listen to Rodney, don't you? [00:23:28] Speaker C: Yeah, we work together once a year. [00:23:31] Speaker B: Oh, nice. [00:23:32] Speaker D: What do you work together on? [00:23:33] Speaker C: At Coinscliffe Festival. [00:23:35] Speaker D: Oh, cool. [00:23:36] Speaker A: Oh yeah, of course. [00:23:38] Speaker C: Yeah. I met her when she was a very young, gorgeous, naive little photographer. And now, you know, I'm sort of bumping shoulders with her in the pit every November. Yeah, we have a few gins and have a bit of fun. [00:23:52] Speaker B: So kick her out of the way. [00:23:54] Speaker A: Yeah. I think she's upset with you because you caught her a child. [00:23:59] Speaker C: Well, you know, at my age you've got to be careful what you say. [00:24:03] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's pretty cool. Actually, folks, we've got Lucinda joining us again on Monday night. Not to talk about Canon necessarily, although we will have Lucinda back for a special Canon panel podcast. But listen, just joining us on Monday night to talk about shooting film in a digital age. So make sure you stay tuned for that. We did go well and truly off track there, Rodney, but that's what we're all about here. So from your earliest days of, of, you know, popping your box brownie, your mum's box brownie, into an ice cream container and thinking that would work, what. What came along next for you? What was after the box brownie experience? Did you focus more on your trade as a carpenter or did you move up in photography? [00:24:50] Speaker B: Look at those. Are they. Are they the cameras from. [00:24:53] Speaker C: Yeah, from. [00:24:54] Speaker B: You just never sold them? You just hung onto them? [00:24:56] Speaker C: No, I just hung on to them. [00:24:58] Speaker D: That's awesome. [00:24:59] Speaker C: They don't work. This one drown. Got drowned many years down the track, hiding. [00:25:06] Speaker D: But did the ice cream container still not work? [00:25:10] Speaker C: What's that? [00:25:11] Speaker D: The ice cream container still didn't work? [00:25:14] Speaker C: Oh, no, I stopped doing that. Not all about that. I got. I got a 400 mil length, so I was pretty safe with it, that. But yeah, so I just pursued. I finished my apprenticeship and I was fortunate enough that my boss, Leo Scott, he had a holiday house in Januk, which is near Bell's Beach. So half the year we'd build in Torquay, half the year we'd build in the western suburbs. And when I flew the coupe, I did a little bit of building here and then chucked that in because I wanted more time to take photos. So, yeah, I did. I did jump ship and work with the ports and harbors, which was driving around in boats, building piers and all that sort of stuff. Marine structures in Port Phillip Bay and. [00:25:59] Speaker A: Wow. [00:25:59] Speaker C: And that at that time of life, the, the late 70s, though, you know, they were really cool with me taking photos and stuff. So I've documented a lot of nautical history in my time. You know, structures that have been decommissioned and taken down that had flocks of gannets living on them. The original Chinaman's hat with the seal colony, you know, all those real historic nautical things. So, you know, we rebuilt piers so I would get to shoot some really weird and wonderful things. Things I still shoot. You know, I love shooting under the pier when the lights. Right. So, yeah, but, yeah, so like, you know, getting back, I go off track, so you've got to pull me back into line every day. [00:26:46] Speaker A: No, we love it. [00:26:47] Speaker C: But I'd go and shoot Bell's beach. I helped a guy who did the sound down there and I'd photograph bells in the 70s. You know all those Rabbit Bartholomew, Mark. Mark Warren, Michael Peterson. So yeah, I did. I sent a bit of stuff to Back Door and Tracks in the early 70s. [00:27:06] Speaker A: So they were magazines, is that right? [00:27:08] Speaker C: Yeah, Tracked magazine. Backdoor was a, A short lived surfing magazine from Torquay, based in Torquay. So, you know, you're just finding your own feet. So I would just shoot. I started doing weddings, parties in anything I had a business card. Rodney Nicholson, photography. Weddings, parties, anything. So I did a decade of weddings after that. But I mean, I shudder at the thought of doing a wedding now. Boudoir Jim. I like a bit of boudoir still. But you know, I, I love, I love doing fashion in the sand dunes in the 70s that was, you know, because you know there's a lot of good magazine or newspapers out back in the day that were, you know, Rolling Stone and I forget some of the other names that were really fashion, music orientated. So yeah, so I was, I was shooting everything that come along and this will trip you out a little bit. So I was shooting slide film. You all know what that is? No. What is it? [00:28:15] Speaker A: I can't make it out. [00:28:17] Speaker B: Some donuts. [00:28:19] Speaker A: Donuts. [00:28:23] Speaker B: Slide projector thingy. [00:28:28] Speaker C: Shooting slide. I set up my own dark room. That photo behind me there is in my dark room where we actually used to cook crayfish as well as I used to print photos and at the same time or go in there with a bottle of wine and a joint or two and come out at 4 in the morning with a spring full of black and white prints. That's how you used to get your 36 rollers slides back. [00:28:57] Speaker A: Yep, I remember. [00:29:00] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah, do. [00:29:01] Speaker B: Ah, so it came like that. You didn't have to. [00:29:03] Speaker A: Yeah, no, no, it came in a little Kodak box. [00:29:07] Speaker C: Yeah, you can't see that's a waterfall on there. It's rock. I was playing with that last night and I thought, oh for. Justin will love that. If I can make a mini projector, he'll think I'm really super clever. [00:29:20] Speaker B: I'd love to have. At some point on this show we got to figure out how to have a slide projector. [00:29:26] Speaker A: Like. [00:29:29] Speaker B: You know, you, you can actually project it and we can watch it. That would be. I don't know how we'll do that. We'll have to set a camera up on a wall or something. That would be amazing. We'll work it out. [00:29:38] Speaker C: That's what we know. Like, because I got into photography for surfing so we would have the annual slide night. But the passion, I mean the guys love that wherever we went surfing, we take surfing photos and shots of ourselves. And my, my slide, my slide nights grew from just having, you know, 120 surfing shots to bloody. They got, they got coined the dodgy flower show, you know, because I'd have a flower, a sunset, my dog. [00:30:11] Speaker B: Were they like. [00:30:16] Speaker C: Come on. [00:30:17] Speaker B: But that's funny. [00:30:20] Speaker C: So you, what I'm saying is like, you know what it's like with photography. You might take it on for one thing, but you know, you open your eyes and it's out there. Everything you see is, is to be photographed, you know. [00:30:32] Speaker A: So, yeah, actually I was at a, at a photography event last night. Surprisingly, the Fujifilm had organized and, and Jason Lau, who was a past guest of our podcast and who is also joining us on Monday night for the why We Shoot Film panel. And he gave a talk at this present, at this event and he talked about how photography for him is about. We see countless moments in our life every day and photography gives us the opportunity to capture that moment and take it home with us. And I really like that, that kind of mindset of, you know, I'm capturing something that is now mine. You know, that, that story, that moment, it's now mine and I can show it to people. And I think that's. We've talked about this before on the podcast, Rodney, where you know that the next step of photography, unless you're working professional or, you know, often we, we, we squirrel all our photos away and we. No one ever gets to see them anymore. So I think it's important, I think slide nights, you know, Lucinda said bring back slide night. And I agree. [00:31:39] Speaker B: I think there's a lot of that. [00:31:41] Speaker A: Yeah, this. I remember family and friends having slide nights probably back in the late 70s when I was young and playing with one of my dad's friends, Polaroid, and he would put on slideshows as well. He was a bit of a keen photographer. And I think there's something magical and romantic about slide nights because you are sharing those moments as you saw them, you know, and moments that no one else was there for, moments that no one else remembers or, or, you know, so yeah, no more of it, I. [00:32:10] Speaker C: Say, and that, that was the beauty in that day. Like you'd shoot, you'd have a slide night. Although when you got a packet of 36 film back, you had that packet there to, you know, Jim And Justin come around for a cup of. Cup of coffee or something in the morning after a surf. And I go, here's a couple of packets I took last week, you know, so you've got 36 prints in your hand, you know. [00:32:36] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, we don't do that anymore. [00:32:39] Speaker C: No, it's. I mean, my working file over two galleries used to be. I don't know where I put it, actually. I'd have an envelope, I'd have a neg strip and I'd have a color corrected, corrected six by four in it. I give that to the girl at my lab. I'd say, I want a 1218 or I want a, you know, five, six by fours. And that's. That was my working catalog. A six by four in a. In a packet with the next strip. And they'd pull it out, enlarge it, print it. When I did anything bigger, I'd go to Bond in Melbourne. So I'd be doing 20 by 30 prints off a small negative. Magically perfect prints, like a bloody neg, you know, I was looking at those, those. Some of those slides and they're, you know, they still look as good in that box as what the day I shot them. So I had two weeks in the rock and luckily I had two days of rain and no one came out for the rain. I couldn't believe it. This is back in 91, I think. And I just have my brolly and my raincoat and my tripod and off I went. I walked around shooting all the waterfalls and I kept looking over my shoulder like, you know, the Aboriginal spirits were out in force. And it was so good, just me waterfalls and all this dreamtime energy. It just blew my mind. And that's something, you know, that's what I love about photography. You know, you're in. You're in that moment. I'm a bit of a gypsy solo shooter. I. Yeah, you know, shooting on the rock shelf at the lighthouse now. Well, in summer there could be a hundred people there shooting sunset, whereas I used to be there on my bloody own. You know, I. I'd be doing time exposures and I'd walk away. I'd smoke back in the day. I'd walk away, have a cigarette, and I go, where's my bloody tripod? Because I might have been doing a half hour or a 15 minute or an hour exposure. What I was doing then was I'd have a little notepad and a torch and I'd write down all my exposures. And when I got my 36 roll of film back I'd go, oh, way over. Oh, that's better, that's on the money. And I set a benchmark for myself of how to do time exposures. I mean I'm talking about, you know, 70s, 80s, you know, there wasn't a lot out there. There wasn't a lot of photographers out there. You know, in the late 70s for me there were, I mean there was a fair few photographers around, but my contemporaries, I was looking at Peter Dombroski and Tassie, Peter Jarva up the top end, Ken Duncan, Steve Parish. You know, I was chasing this Australiana dream myself but I was in Queensland Point Lonsdale. So you know, I was a bit far removed from it. But where, where am I? Mid-80s? I decided to open my first gallery. I don't, I really don't know. I wish I knew now what was going on in my head to do that. But like what, what a jump, you know, I'm opening a gallery in 1987 but you know, sometimes your path is already indirectly predetermined and you've just got to have that faith to run with it. So you know, there I was looking at all these Australiana guys and next minute I opened the gallery. Well, next thing I had, I did a little business course to learn how to sort of run shop and I decided to get on the Australian made logo as a, a good Aussie thing. Well from that, from that, somehow it led to the Australian Design Council wanting to check out my gallery and my work. Then I got incorporated in a book called Australia's Best and I found that many things looking for this book yesterday that I didn't find the book but I found lots of other little show and tell things. But anyway, that, that getting in Australia. Australia's best book was a digest of Australian achievement. And I was officially invited to World Expo at Brisbane for the launch of the book. Wow, that was pretty. That was pretty prestigious back then for me. It was like, whoa. I got the front page of the Echo, the local paper, got a champagne round at the council with the mayor. [00:37:17] Speaker A: Living the high life. [00:37:19] Speaker D: You've made it now. [00:37:20] Speaker C: Well down in, you know, little old smoky coins. Cliff, Buddy and I had the opportunity, but I wasn't financial enough. I had a great opportunity to have a stall in the Australian pavilion if I wanted it. But I had to say no on it, you know, because I don't want, I'm just embarking on this career now. This is 88, remember I've, I've only been selling. Sorry, I jumped a bit there. I started, I started selling at 82 at the Queenscliff Market. A, a dear friend of mine said, geez Rodney, your work's really lovely. So I put together 20 of these in aluminum and took them to the market and I sold most of them. I got these two back from the op shop for two bucks a pop. [00:38:07] Speaker B: You found, you bought your own, your own photos back. [00:38:10] Speaker C: Yeah, mate, you're not famous to. You end up in the op shop. These are on the wall in the op shop. This is going back about 10 years. And this lady was looking at him, she was holding one of them and I went, oh my God. Them. I haven't got any of them because I'm a tourist, so I'm a bit of a bow bird sentimentalist, you know, collector. Anyway, I, I, I shuffled up next to her and minute she put them down, I grabbed them and I'm at the checkout beside her and she said, oh, I was nearly going to buy them. And I said, I know. And she said, they're gorgeous, aren't. I said, yes. You know What? They are two of the first pieces I ever sold back in 1982. [00:38:53] Speaker D: That's amazing. [00:38:54] Speaker A: You found, that's phenomenal. Full circle story. [00:38:56] Speaker D: Yeah. [00:38:57] Speaker C: 1979, those shots were taken. [00:39:01] Speaker A: Yep. [00:39:02] Speaker B: Do you remember, do you have any idea how much you sold them for? Any getting rough? You sold them for 40, bought them back for two. That is the dream. That's a business. Yeah. If you could do that, if you can do that a million times. [00:39:17] Speaker C: Wow. I, yeah, I collect. Well, not a lot, but you know, every now and then I get a couple of pieces. [00:39:25] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:39:25] Speaker C: So, yeah. [00:39:27] Speaker A: And so Rodney, from, from selling selling your, your frame photos at the market. Talk to us about what led up to you going, you know what, I'm gonna, I'm gonna, I'm gonna start a gallery. [00:39:45] Speaker C: I, I can't recall, that's a long time ago, you know, but that shot there, which you might not be able to see, that's me holding my Pentex in the mirror, right. And I'm saying to myself, I'm gonna go somewhere with this. You know, I had this vision that I'm, I want to be a photographer, I want to be good at what I do and I want to make a career out of it. So I guess I just jumped right into it, you know. [00:40:13] Speaker A: Yep. [00:40:14] Speaker C: Boots and all from selling. I started doing markets from 82. Then I opened my first gallery, 87, 88. That was a six year term. So of course, you know, I went to Brisbane As a guest, official guest of the Australian pavilion for Expo. So that started to plant the seed of, you know, I made handmade cards. I had a range of 66 cards in my gallery. It's a great gallery too, because it's an 1800s building and it had a sandstone underground space. So you went on my ground floor, went down the stairs, and I hung in the sandstone and the big post. [00:40:57] Speaker A: Yep. [00:40:58] Speaker C: So, you know, I work pretty hard at maintaining that because we're in sleepy old queens. Because summertime was good, but off season, you know, you could shoot a gun up the bloody street. So. [00:41:11] Speaker D: You know, how did you balance, like running the gallery and then also trying to fill the gallery with. With photography, like photos. [00:41:20] Speaker C: Well, I. I started, I. I was so much in my little. Not my package, my bloody history. When I left my apprenticeship, I said, you. I went to the ports and harbors. I worked there for five years and that was great, but, you know, 8. 8 till 4 or 8 to 5 was just too much. So I put my hand up to. To work at the Ozone Hotel as boots. So that was dawn lighting fires, doing this, doing that. And weirdly enough, I worked my way up to being second chef there. Quite bizarrely, you know, they needed a waiter one time, so I'd finished my shift and I put on the. The black suit and go and wait her. And then one day they were down at kitchen hand and my good friend Lenny, who I end up cooking with for a fair while, he said, you're pot washing today, Rodney. You get your black and white off. So I went and pot wash. And he said, there's an order come in for 10 seafood cocktails, you know. And I said, oh, 10 seafood cocktail. Remember I'm a Taurus. And I left home at 18, so it was sink or swim. So I learned to cook for myself. But anyway, I go into the cool room and I go, yes. Yeah, all right. Fantastic. Good stuff. Anyway, I'm making these seafood cocktails that look like, you know, flaming Lamborghinis and bloody. I took them up to the front. He's. He's jaw hit the floor. And he went, that's 20, 50 bucks. Where the seafood in that? And I go, how good are they? You know? And he said, oh, you're starting with me in the kitchen. So that, you know. So Jim, I. I often jump ship and, you know, spotted with cooking or carpentry. All my photography career, whenever I needed a buck, I could always put a nail bag on because I was quite good. I was apprentice of the year when I did my apprenticeship and I love working with wood, but why I got out of building was. It just wasn't creative. And I didn't realize that there was this creative bubble inside me. I was dreaming of building homemade houses with rocks and sleepers and. And all I was doing was from my apprenticeship doing hardwood frames. You come home with brown sappy hands every night to. When I moved down to here, there was a new push to pine frames and it was just so boring, just banging up a pine frame, moving on to the next one move. And so I left to build piers, become a wharf carpenter. But that allowed me to photograph as well as I said, you know, I could show you some great photos of seals on structures, gannets, you know, so. So all the while my photography was just being nurtured with even those job situations, you know. [00:44:24] Speaker B: So would you take your camera to work with you? Is that. Yeah, just. Yep. Bring it every day. [00:44:30] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:44:30] Speaker B: What. What would be the average sort of kit for every day? You know, camera, camera that you would take while you were working with the wolves, for example? [00:44:39] Speaker C: Well, back, back then, you know, that we're talking about screw mount kit. So I had a fleet of lenses like, you know, I fondly remember running along the beach, beach going, pull that bloody lens out and put the 300 on and shoot the sunset, you know, and then that's a 28, that one. You know, I'd be changing lenses as fast as I bloody could. Then I had two. I had the Spotmatic, then the good old K1000. This probably took some of the best photos I've ever taken in my life. [00:45:13] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:45:14] Speaker B: God, they must have sold a lot of those cameras. How many people have come on this podcast and said they've had a K1000? [00:45:20] Speaker C: I know, you know, the few times that I've watched your show, I've gone, oh, I've got to make a comment. All these K1000 people, you know, they're everywhere. [00:45:29] Speaker D: Maybe we need to get one. [00:45:31] Speaker C: Even the shutter, the shutter speed. Can you hear that? It's so beautiful. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Look, I know Lucinda's gone. We often talk about pen taxes. [00:45:42] Speaker B: She's got two. [00:45:43] Speaker C: Lucinda's got a six, seven. I've got a six, seven. They're beautiful. Six sevens. [00:45:49] Speaker B: But anyway, while we're in the chat, there's actually a question here for you. Actually, there's comment first, then a question first one from RXA Photography. This was about here. Photos, selling photos. $40 back then has got to be worth like 2, 000 in today. Money that's pretty impressive. [00:46:05] Speaker C: Yeah, possibly so. You know, I mean. Well, I think that cost me 12 bucks for the kit and probably the aluminum kit and probably $20 for the print, maybe. So. Yeah, that's. How good's that? I mean, Jesus Christ, I'd like to be getting $2,000 of print nowadays. [00:46:27] Speaker B: Be nice. I mean, these days it's probably. It's probably hard to sell a print for $40 now. Like, it's not easy to sell prints these days. [00:46:34] Speaker C: Yeah, well, I sell that. [00:46:36] Speaker B: Look at that. [00:46:36] Speaker C: I sell that for 800. [00:46:40] Speaker B: That's big. [00:46:42] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:46:42] Speaker D: What, like, what's that costing to get that sort of framed and printed? [00:46:49] Speaker C: Oh, well, that's 250, 250 up, depending where you go. I have a few good contacts. Probably you could pay more if you're in Melbourne. You probably pay 400 to do that. [00:47:04] Speaker D: Yeah. [00:47:05] Speaker C: You know, even canvas is expensive now. [00:47:10] Speaker B: Yeah. Couple more. One more comment and a question. Pete Mellow says, I love how Rodney just jumps in with both feet. Me too. That's awesome. [00:47:19] Speaker C: Good on you, Pete. [00:47:21] Speaker B: And. And Dave in the chat. I know Dave, you've been on the show before. I can't remember. Dave says, of all the genres out there, what does Rodney enjoy shoot the most? [00:47:32] Speaker C: Oh. Oh, look, you know, I'm. I'm at my. I'm at my best. You know, I always say it's my meditation. Like, everything else just gets washed away when I'm at. At the sea or the sunset or the sunrise, the ocean. But that's so calming anyway, you know what I mean? You just get taken on a bloody journey. So I love waves. I love waves exploding like that, you know, like, you know, the bommy is another. When that. That's the rip. So when that breaks, that's fascinating. Can you see how big that is? [00:48:08] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, a little bit. I mean, bring it, bring it closer, bring it closer, bring it closer. Yeah, yeah, we want to see. Yeah, that's cool. [00:48:18] Speaker A: Yeah, you can see the sp. The mountain. [00:48:20] Speaker C: I've got better ones than that. But that day, the northerly wind, the northwest wind was so strong, strong. The spray was going, you know, hundreds and hundreds of miles off the top of the wave and out. It was just beautiful. But you're going back to my kit. You know, I. I wasn't going to take my full kit to bloody work with me, so I just choose a lens, either a 28 or a 50. I'd know. I'd know what I was, where I was working. So what, you know, a wide angle of 28 was good at a pier, if you wanted to get the whole peer in with. With the birds, you know. [00:48:57] Speaker B: What do we got here? More show and tell. [00:49:01] Speaker C: So see that? Yeah, that's a wide angle and I'm on the bow of my boat there. And this is storytelling. This is called building the nest. What I wanted to do here was get the boys flying in with the floatsome injection for her to make the nest. She never leaves the nest. Once she's. Once she's building, she has the chick, they. They go diving. You would have seen them diving and they swallow fish whole, come home, land and regurgitate the fish at her feet. So I'm. I'm about this close to her and. And the surge is moving the bow of my boat like this. And she picked me a couple. Pecked the lens a couple of times. Wow. You know, so, I mean, she's a pretty big bird too, so. [00:49:50] Speaker D: Yeah, it's a very cool shot. [00:49:53] Speaker C: Totally love getting engaged. [00:49:56] Speaker B: Was that, Was that shot on digital or film? [00:50:00] Speaker C: That's film. [00:50:01] Speaker B: That was film. How many, how many attempts did you have at getting those birds in the show in the background? [00:50:08] Speaker C: I would have probably shot a roll easy there because the whole idea was to get the two flying in, in the same frame as her. So that was a bit of a. Bit of an ask, you know what I mean? [00:50:20] Speaker A: Yeah. Whilst on a rocking boat. [00:50:22] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And. And looking through the lens, you know, not, you know, not with today's technology, you can sort of flip the lid. This is another one I love. This is called Pick Me, Rodney, Pick Me. My gallery. My gallery used to be just up the road, just up the road from Swan Bay. So I'd knock, I'd shut shop and load up my camera and go for a wander in Swan Bay. And I always loved shooting pelicans, but I thought I'd be very smart this time. And I took a bucket of fresh fish with me. So I'm crouched down with the wide angle lens on and I'm jiggling the fish up and down like this and talking to them, one hand on the camera and the noise they were making, they were going psycho. And all of a sudden, how good's this? You know, then that. See the one with his wings about to take off? [00:51:25] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:51:27] Speaker C: He launched at me, flattened me, got the fish and I was just laying in the Swan Bay mud. I'll just piss myself laughing. I just thought, what an idiot. [00:51:41] Speaker B: How long can you tease a group of pelicans for? Before one of them was like, nah, not Too long. [00:51:46] Speaker C: I assure you that. That wasn't, you know, it wasn't. It wasn't half an hour. It was probably five minutes and now right into it. But I should print up the other shots because that one and then I've just got sort of like a flock of feathers coming over my head and bloody. But yeah, so, I mean, that stuff I love as well, you know, that's. Yeah, yeah. [00:52:11] Speaker A: So, Rodney, the gallery that you opened, that wasn't the only time that you've opened a gallery. You have had it, you have done it twice, Is that correct? [00:52:20] Speaker C: Yeah. So, Greg, it was 87, 88 through to 93. And then I re. I re. Had another crack in 2000-2006. That was. That one was really successful. I didn't have to work for that. I worked my butt off in that one. I probably did 100 hours a week in that one. You know, at the same time. I'll go back to that. When I finished the. The first one, I mean, I. I had some great gigs. I sailed on tall ships and photographed them up in the rigging. Now that was freaking awesome. Out in Bass Straight, you know, a couple of hundred feet up in the bloody yard. Arms with the wide angle on, shooting down through the sails and whoa. You know, such an adventure in that sort of period between galleries and I. The acf, the Australian Conservation foundation, they put a call out for photographers to do the St Kilda de Bondi Walk and document it because they were going to do a photographic book on it on the walk. So I put my hand up and went on that. I only did half that walk. Walk. But that was awesome because we had a. We had a field crew that cooked for us and set up camp and we'd sleep wherever we were on the beach, whatever, and just move on the next day and walk and photograph and explore and, you know, meet with environmental groups, meet with councils, meet with all sorts of people with all sorts of environmental problems along the way. So, you know, the environment has been sort of a strong thing for me as well. You know, I've always been aware of pollution and. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So in between galleries there was lots of projects. I went initially, I went, what am I going to do now? I closed that set first gallery. So mate of mine was said, why don't you go to Melbourne and become an assistant? So I did. I went to a studio called Decent Exposure in Paran and I was the oldest assistant in Melbourne, but. But it worked to my advantage because, you know, I had good head smarts and Had a good background and so I worked with some of the best car photographers. Decent exposure was two story. It had its own cyclorama and we had Kenworth trucks, Kmart, Maya, BMW, all these accounts, like, you know, so it was like, you know, I was like a kid in a lolly shop. All this new stuff to learn, you know. So, yeah, that was. I was doing that midweek and then coming home on the weekend and doing my own thing and you know, that's, that's mid, mid-90s. I was doing that. [00:55:16] Speaker A: Yep. [00:55:17] Speaker B: Wow. Crazy. So we're only up to mid-90s. [00:55:21] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:55:23] Speaker D: Not even. [00:55:24] Speaker B: What are we, halfway? [00:55:26] Speaker D: Not either. [00:55:28] Speaker B: That's amazing. [00:55:32] Speaker C: Justin. You made me do a bloody book. Like, you know, I started to plot everything I bloody did, you know, I was like, whoa, holy. [00:55:40] Speaker B: Oh, this is awesome. Look at those notes. [00:55:42] Speaker C: Finding stuff, you know. Oh, sorry, that's the page. There's two pages of. Mind you, I was popping off the odd exhibition as well. So, you know, I, I had my first show in 84 at the Universal Theater in Fitzroy. [00:56:06] Speaker B: Lucinda's in the chat, throwing stones. [00:56:11] Speaker C: Yeah, we can wind it up now. [00:56:14] Speaker A: No, no, not at all. [00:56:15] Speaker B: That's just getting rolling. [00:56:17] Speaker C: I haven't got to working with Lucinda yet. [00:56:22] Speaker B: Did you say that that was your. [00:56:23] Speaker C: First show or.84 was my first show. [00:56:27] Speaker B: Yep. [00:56:28] Speaker C: Yeah, I've had, I've lost count now. I've had over 50. I've got to go back and find my. I documented all my shows for an exhibition when you had a CV and da, da, da, da, da. But I haven't, I haven't added onto it because 206, I become a dad, you know, like I was 50, I'd become a late dad. So that changed the flight of everything. So we'll get to that. But I used to tie him up in ropes down the harbor and shoot boats. Boats are another thing that's a big passion of mine. I love boats, Diggies and boats and water and. [00:57:06] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, there's something about boats, isn't there? There's something about that journey or the promise of a journey that a boat offers. You know, it's. There's something very romantic about boats in photography. [00:57:21] Speaker B: Exactly. [00:57:21] Speaker C: But, you know, just exploration. [00:57:24] Speaker A: Yeah, well, it can mean so many things to so many people. It can mean escape, it can mean freedom, it can mean refuge. So much can be, you know, pulled out of a story about a photo with a boat. And I think, you know, looking at the chat, Rodney, there's a couple of comments about how for the folks that are watching and listening along. It's more than just the images. It's the stories that you have behind everything that you've done. And I think that's. That's something that is also a lost art of storytelling. You know, lots of people can take photos now because we all carry a camera in our pocket, but the, the art of the storytelling along with imagery is really important. You know, storytelling has been a. Is something that we've used to educate future generations. It's to. To warn people about, you know, what's happened in the past, to prepare for the future. And I think that one of the things that's. That's standing out for me listening to you is, is that narrative that goes along, that visual language that you include with every image. I think that's, that's something to be incredibly proud. Proud of. So talk to us about some of the shows that you did, some of the bigger shows. What, what was that experience like for you? Because a lot of photographers want to do a show. We've talked about this often. You know, lots of photographers dream of printing and, and putting works on display. What was that process like for you? [00:58:49] Speaker C: I mean, exciting, scary. Lots of, lots of things come into play because you're putting. You're putting your heart and soul on the line. You're putting possible rejection on the line, failure on the line, money on the line. You know, back in, Back in my. Not my early days, later on in life, mid-90s, late-90s, I would chuck about 6 grand at a show. And that's a bit of a gamble, but. And admittedly, well, not admittedly, I was fortunate enough to do a Frame your own course in 1986, which gave me access to a workshop, mat cutters, molding cutters, everything like that. So I became everything I did from 1986 to probably 2015. I hand framed myself. And I loved it. You know, millimeter, perfect, the matte cutting, everything was so, so precise. You know, I stylized my own style as well. You know, my, you know, like this one here. You know, I used to love doing V mount black cores. So all that was all cut by hand, by me. So I was saving, I was saving a lot of money, but I was still pumping six grand into a show. And then you've got to plot it, then you've got to promote it. Then you. But, you know, like, that was good because back in the day you had to do a DL. Well, I did a DL card as an invite. Right. Where's my first? So you would send out a Couple of hundred of them. [01:00:36] Speaker A: Yep. [01:00:36] Speaker C: Mailing there wasn't. So, you know, for every show I do something like that, you know, and yeah, I would do. I mean, 97. I did a show called Time and Time Won't Let a Sailor Sleep. And it was about Queenscliff, fishermen, boats, harbor life and all that stuff, you know, so there was. There was abstract fish. [01:01:06] Speaker D: That's a great shot. [01:01:08] Speaker C: You know, fisherman's portraits. And back in 97, they were all still alive. Harry Lewis, Bluey Buzzer. All those guys were still alive. You know, they're not. None of them are. They're all passed on now. But before the harbor was developed, we used to go and hang out down the slip and watch them work on their boats and just take photos and talk to them and learn and story, you know, history of when the Cooter fleet used to work out of Queenscliff. So that all that stuff is sort of only in the Maritime Museum now. So. But, yeah, I mean, you know, I'll be working like a navy dog because I had 97. I had a couple of shows up my belt before I decided what made me open the second gallery was like, I'm touring the bay. I'd go Queenscliff, Williamstown, Port Melbourne, Sandringham, Mornington. I take the same show on the road and add more images from that area into the show. So it evolved, you know, it was something for Jim and his area, something for Justin at Port Melbourne, as well as the old fisherman from Queens Club. So, you know, I was selling that well that I went, Jesus, I'm losing 30 commission here. I'm probably chucking 30% at making my images, my molding, my glass, my da, da, da. I'm paying a gallery owner 30%, so I might as well put the commission into rent. So hence I open my second gallery in 2000. [01:02:49] Speaker A: And where was that? Where was that located? [01:02:52] Speaker C: That was in Queensciff Main street as well. Except I went down the bottom of the road in an old hardware shop, which I renovated totally. I stripped it, stripped all the lino out hand, you know, floor, sanded the floor, varnished it. Oh, Brucey Priddle, who's an old legend, not with us anymore, he come around to have. I said, come around. Have a look what I've done. And he opened the door and he said, holy, the rent's going up now. And I hadn't even opened the gallery. But, you know, I just sort of. I just. It had to be right, you know. So, yeah, copped all the walls in the ceiling and painted the whole Thing with ceiling white. So if you're ever out there, if any of you are gonna gypsy a space or work on it, buy some ceiling white and just paint it in ceiling white. Don't. Don't get carried away with expensive paint. Ceiling white's great. It. It hides all the imperfections, you know? Yeah, but. Yeah, so I don't know if I answered that question, Justin. [01:04:00] Speaker A: I think I asked. That's okay. You did. You did well and truly. [01:04:04] Speaker B: What was that gallery called? Was it just your name? [01:04:07] Speaker C: My first one was Seascapes, Natural elements Photography. So then when I'm my second one, I called it Sea Gems. [01:04:17] Speaker B: Okay, now what. Why the name change? [01:04:21] Speaker C: Seascapes was purely gallery. Like, you know, I was doing smart gallery by the time 2000 come around C gems. I. If you can see my house, it's full of shipwreck stuff. And so the gallery was like a nautical shop. You know, There was everything that I collected from the sea. All around the windows was copper wire with bits of broken shell and glass. And, you know, it was. Yeah, it was. It was like a c gem. And then my photos were all around the walls. Where was that one guy? I don't know. But, you know, it was full on. Like, I'd make 20 of these a week. So that was my bread and butter range that. I sold that for 50 bucks. [01:05:11] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:05:11] Speaker A: Yep. [01:05:12] Speaker C: So I had, you know, at child I height, I'd have probably 60 of these around the wall, and then above, I'd have my limited edition stuff. But this. This used to go well as a wedding present or a birthday present. 50 bucks was school. So, you know. [01:05:31] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:05:32] Speaker C: So you got to develop, you know, a lot goes into it, developing a product range. Then I started doing calendars. That was a bit scary, you know, doing calendars because I wanted to sort of do a production that sort of serviced everybody, one per page. So the printing costs went up and to get. Get the color reproduction right was I'd go up to the printer and spend all night there doing one sheet at a time. And this European guy, Emil, I think his name was, he was fantastic. He just loved that I would stay there and take the time to get every bit of color in the print. Right. So, you know, that. That. And that was a big production. And I'd pick it up from Murrumbina, I think it was. And so then I drive from Murrambina around the other side of the bay, dumping this at bookstops, bookshops, news agents, whatever, whoever would take it. And then there'd be A pallet on the gallery floor and people would just come in and take it out of the box on the pallet, you know. But I was ridiculous. I was mad. I was printing like a thousand bloody copies, you know. But yeah, I was gunned, I was crazy. Not crazy, I was just into it, you know, having a crap. [01:06:57] Speaker D: Confident. [01:06:58] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. [01:07:00] Speaker B: Sounds like it was going great too. Like it sounds like. Obviously. [01:07:04] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah, I'd have a, I'd have a surfing holiday to Queensland twice a year off season. So that suited my lifestyle, you know. [01:07:15] Speaker A: Yeah. Do you still get out and, and, and surf? [01:07:19] Speaker C: I, I do everything but I sup, I dive. I did a rotator cuff tear several years ago and as much as it's okay now if I, if I'm swimming, I usually swim in shorts till May. If I over swim, I can feel it twing a little bit. [01:07:38] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:07:39] Speaker C: So surfing, because I was out of it for so long, I'm a bit of an egg now. I'm not, I was quite competent in my day, but now. [01:07:54] Speaker D: We'Re not surfers. Rodney, what does an egg mean? [01:07:57] Speaker B: Explain. Yeah, swimming. What, so when you're an egg, is. [01:08:01] Speaker C: It novice, you know, someone that easily broken. Easily broken, God, soft on the inside. But you know, I mean at my age it doesn't matter. I, I mean I just have a lot of fun, you know, having a crack now, you know what I mean? I'm. Yeah, yeah, I started surfing well, God, 60 something. So, you know, I'd love to be still doing it. I surf in the mine because I photograph waves and I watch the sea all the time. So you mindset what we call mine surf. But yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm working on it. I get up and fall off and laugh at myself and it's like, hey, how good is that? You're laughing at yourself. Bloody hell. Yeah, did you know, you know, I talk to a lot of crew that start late in life and I go, listen, just don't take it so bloody seriously, you know, just, you know, chuck the ego out the door. Get out there, it's healthy, it's fit, you're energized, fall off, laugh and you'll get there. Just keep at it, you know, you'll get there. [01:09:06] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. I just want to explain, I just want to explain a term for, especially for some of our international viewers that having a crack means having a go, giving it a, giving it a good shot. It's an Australian slang term and Rodney delivers it with perfection. So thanks for that. Rodney having a crack. [01:09:30] Speaker C: Yeah. [01:09:30] Speaker A: I love that. I love that term. [01:09:32] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. You forget, don't you? You forget what we, what we carry on about our lingo. [01:09:39] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, you do sometimes. [01:09:40] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:09:41] Speaker A: You say things. Oh, that might not make sense to people. So Rodney, the second gallery sounded like it was going bang gangbusters. And what, what came, what was the, the turning point for you where that was no longer something that you wanted to sustain. [01:09:58] Speaker C: The second gallery. Yeah, it ran for six years. [01:10:03] Speaker A: Yep. [01:10:03] Speaker C: And as I said, you. I'd have a show in January. I had took on staff then, so I'd be running the show. I'd make all the stock myself and I'd make the stop for another exhibition as well down in what I. What I call the Pavilion down in Queenscliff. So I, I'd have a girl in my shop and I'd be running the show and we swap, you know. So one was sort of retail indirectly because I did cards, calendars, you know, the $50 range, the limited edition stuff. And then the show was just one two week solo show. [01:10:39] Speaker A: Y. [01:10:40] Speaker C: My partner and I fell pregnant in 2006 and the old shop that I was renting, I lived there as well. And it had a really old 1800 staircase going down below. So my partner didn't want to raise my young, fell there and he was due to pop out in December. So I just went, oh, okay. Well my lease was due, so I didn't resign and thought I got to reinvent myself now. And she had a really good job, so she was the bread and butter when I went to sort of a bit more of a babysitter, freelance photographer. Foolishly. Yeah. I said to John the other, he's 18 now. I said to him the other night, you know what, Because I sent him, I sent him some photos of when he was young and I said we should have done a book on plate Kids play parks because we just drive and go to all these different play parks, you know, to break up the monotony, the. And I thought to myself, geez, you know, there was a market for a bloody little soft, like a Rainy Ellis type book on, you know, kids adventure spots. So. [01:11:50] Speaker A: Yep. [01:11:51] Speaker C: But you know, I'd still shoot boats and I'd. There'd be big coils of rope from the big trawlers and that down the harbor. And I'd say, plonk him in there and say, you stay there, you know, while I, you know, and he could see me and he sort of enjoyed that. So a classic. I'll never forget one time he was in there And I said, there's the pilot launch. And the pilot launch went past, and they blasted the horn out of his. Waving his little head above a coil of, you know, big girth rope like that. He's, you know, fun little memories of moments like that. [01:12:21] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. No, they're. They're special, aren't they? [01:12:24] Speaker C: I did have one of the most amazing. Well, not amazing, but I got a phone call. I was at Gallery Without Peers. Have you ever heard of Galleria Without Pier in Sandringham? No, no, no. Okay, it's moved. It's moved now. But it was a great gallery in. In Sandy. And I do. I had a residency and I'd go up on weekends and man my show or be there with the gallery director, and always did that. And I got a phone call and said, oh, Rodney, we've got a. I've got a man here, a fellow here. He wants to meet you. And I said, oh, cool. Yeah, yeah. When does he want. You know what? When, When. When does he want to meet? Rah, rah, rah. She said, oh, he's happy whenever you want her. And I said, cool, what's his name? And she said, wolfgang Savers. And I went, Wolfgang Savers? I went, you don't know Wolfgang Savers? [01:13:23] Speaker B: I was like. I was waiting for Greg to cry. I was like, greg will know who it is. I don't know. All right, you'll have to school us all. You'll have to school us. What, Who. Who's Wolfgang Savers? [01:13:32] Speaker C: Well, he's. Oh, he's an icon. Australian. He did all that black and white industrial stuff. You know, the big matchsticks and all the big cogs and everything like that. Wolfgang's German guy who came out. He was. He's into fashion and more industrial. Really? He's up there. He's up there with Max Dupain, Peter David Moore, all those crew as an Australiana legend photographer. Yeah. But he was exhibiting in Portugal and he loved my Portugal stuff that was in this exhibition. So, I mean, I just said dog when, When. Oh, anytime I'm there, you know. So I had a great meet with him, walked around, he talked about. I mean, I'm, you know, I'm just. My jaws really on the floor. I had a photo. I couldn't find it to show. You got. Got the portrait shot with him, of course. But yeah, anyway, after doing all that, he invited me home for a cup of tea. So there you go, Google. Good old Google. [01:14:35] Speaker B: Good old Google. [01:14:37] Speaker C: He invited me home for a cup of tea and he Lived at Sandringham. There you go. Look at those shots. And it's such great black and white. Yeah, he print. Of course he printed all himself. He was a working photographer like, like that. That's. Those pieces are worth a fortune to buy now. Anyway, cutting a long story short walk into his lounge room and there was his enlarger. And I went, my God, it's like a bloody temple and a shrine and all around, all around the, the wall was black and whites of Max and David Moore and all these legends that I'd grown up going, wow, love, love those guys work, you know. But anyway, that was a real abuzz. And he said to me, listen, when the curator of the Lisbon Gallery comes over, I want you to bring up all your Portugal stuff to show him. So I went, oh my God, what a, what a bonus that is, you know, But I, I missed the boat. Long story, I won't go into it, but I missed that boat. So, you know, I. It's probably not a lot of young crew out there listening, but, you know, you got to grab the bull by the horn sometimes and never let an opportunity slip because, you know, a lot of opportunities only come once. So, you know, I don't, I don't regret anything. But, you know, that would have been a lovely opportunity because he was getting older, I could have become his chaperone and went over there and took a folio of my stuff and because I spent a couple of months in Portugal and Spain, see, in between all that too, talking about Jim, the stuff I was doing, I was traveling too. I was in Indo, I was in Thailand, I was in Europe, you know, traveling, photographing. Hence why I didn't really settle down to 50. I sort of played hard till I was 50 and then become a dad and had responsibilities. [01:16:34] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:16:35] Speaker B: Speaking of rude awakening, Sam Olsen chiming in from the chat, she said, it's not babysitting when they're your children. [01:16:46] Speaker C: There you go. [01:16:47] Speaker B: My brother in law for that too. I got. I gotta babysit the kids. Yeah, they're your kids. [01:16:54] Speaker A: Babysitters get paid. [01:16:57] Speaker B: A couple of other comments that have come in. Mark Blut Hoofed says previous guest, wonderful guest. CGMS was a great gallery, beautifully themed and of course great images. Was always great to chat with Rod. And also the one and only Brendan Waits from Cameron photo down the great ocean road direction, but also from the down south photo show, one of the top podcasts just behind this one. No, I'm just kidding, guys. Brandon says I've printed for Rodney a fair bit over the journey. The stories behind the shots are great. G' day, Rod. [01:17:34] Speaker A: Yeah. And there's a question. [01:17:35] Speaker C: Respond to those. [01:17:37] Speaker B: Yeah, respond to anything you want. [01:17:39] Speaker C: Yeah. Yeah. Cheers to Mark. He messaged me this morning, wishing me well, which was lovely because I was flapping around because, like, I've just got prints and everywhere here, because I know Justin likes to go and tell. So I went overboard with show and tell. [01:17:54] Speaker A: You've done well, mate. You've done us proud. [01:17:56] Speaker B: It's what makes the show. [01:17:58] Speaker C: So thanks, Mark, for that early morning call. And Brendan. Yeah, Brendan. I love Brendan. He's always. He's always ready to do something for you. He's done a lot of my stuff over the years, so, yeah, no good bloke. I'll be mean to get over and say hello to him, actually. And he remastered one of my famous. Well, when I shouldn't say famous, a shot I took in 1987 and I got a call from a. A lady saying she Rodney, I want a copy of that Lighthouse Reflections of yours. I sprinkled my husband's ashes in there and mine are going in there and my son's going in there. And I'm thinking, oh, holy dooley. And anyway, it was a 1987 neg. So I said, oh, you know, might not be up to scratch at the moment, or, you know, where the hell is it? Because, I mean, when you've been shooting this long, you have that much, you know, footage and neg slides. But anyway, we managed to get a. A copy that wasn't, you know, exactly to color. And Brendan. Brendan fantastically remastered it and I proudly. It was a pro. It was a proud. He printed me one. He printed that lady one. We had a satisfied customer there. And it took center stage of my 50th retrospective, if. Because it's sort of the shot that put me on the map for my first gallery, because I've never been able to repeat it ever since. And I've tried to and I know a lot of other photographers have, but it was all about the light this morning, that it was a dawn and the lighthouse, just the rock pool and the lighthouse were just glass and the reflection was amazing. And it happened just because before I opened my first gallery. And the media just love that photo. So it just got, you know, in every newspaper article. And D. [01:20:01] Speaker B: Hang on. He's gone. [01:20:05] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:20:08] Speaker B: Oh, that's cool. [01:20:10] Speaker C: Hang on. Not digital. That's film. One shot, one neck. [01:20:16] Speaker B: Wow. [01:20:19] Speaker C: But you can even see fishing. It was just one of them magic mornings, like, I believe the Universe chucks things your way, you know, y. [01:20:32] Speaker B: He's got so much stuff. [01:20:34] Speaker A: Should we jump to. [01:20:36] Speaker B: There is a good question. [01:20:37] Speaker C: Seventies hippies. But you know, I firmly believe that shot just happened in that moment, you know, so. [01:20:46] Speaker D: Yeah, yeah, but that stuff doesn't just happen. That's you as well. [01:20:50] Speaker B: Well, it gets put there, but you've got to be ready to. Yeah, ready to see it. [01:20:55] Speaker C: Yeah, absolutely. You've got, and you know, the good old K1000 was ready to expose it correctly and yeah, Rodney's noggin was really. [01:21:05] Speaker B: You know, we've got, we've got a question for you, Rodney, from the chat. I'm gonna, I'll give this name a go. You'll have to let me know, Roman, if I, if I get it even remotely close. So from Roman Bohorquez. I don't know. [01:21:22] Speaker A: Yeah, where you, where you from, Roman? [01:21:25] Speaker B: Where you from, Roman? And also, yeah, how do we pronounce your surname? It says ask Rodney. Everywhere is different. But of all the places you've had the chance to shoot, do you have a favorite shooting location? [01:21:38] Speaker C: Oh, no, I, I, I, No, I really, I mean home is here. I've got home here. I've got this all the time. This is my backyard. The lighthouse, the sunset, the bomy breaking in the rip. That's my backyard. I'd have to say that. But you know, when you have a couple of weeks at the rock and you get a waterfall, you know, like that for a solid day, you know, that was pretty spectacular. [01:22:04] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:22:06] Speaker C: You know, Portugal and Spain, you know, the back streets, the fishermen of Portugal and Spain was pretty amazing. You know, this one, a gold medal in Vijex and that like, that's just sardines filleted on a net. It doesn't look sharp to the screen though. [01:22:25] Speaker B: It's, it's, you know, the Internet doesn't do them justice. [01:22:28] Speaker C: Yeah, no, unfortunately that's pin sharp. But that one won a gold medal in the Vijects in 2000. So I was, I was competing a fair bit and then, then all of a sudden, you know, competition didn't really matter anymore. But, you know, it was a nice thing to do, you know, put stuff in with Viex was worldwide, so there was a lot of, a lot of entries coming into Vik. So it was pretty, pretty nice to win a gold medal in that when you're not really expecting to. And so, you know, it's always nice to get something when you're not expecting it. [01:23:04] Speaker A: But. [01:23:05] Speaker C: Yeah. So Roman, sorry to answer that question. Yeah. Look, wherever, wherever the sun shines and I got my two feet on the ground, I'm bloody happy. [01:23:19] Speaker A: Not bad. Southern California. We get a fair bit of love from. From Southern California, I think. Or at least California anyway. [01:23:31] Speaker D: Have you got older, Justin? [01:23:33] Speaker B: I do have the ground. Groundskeeper Willie is here. That's why I have to keep muting myself. That you can hear the leaf blower. Welcome. Yeah, well, I wish, I kind of wish we were in SoCal today because what is this? If it's 95 in wherever David mascara is, which is San Francisco, it's probably closer to 100 down there. So, yeah, living the dream. [01:23:58] Speaker D: What's that? In regular temperature. [01:24:02] Speaker B: I think 95 is what, close to 30ish, right around that 30ish mark. I can't remember off the top of my head, but it's. It's nice, warm summer's day. [01:24:11] Speaker A: Just while we're taking a moment to. To talk about the weather, I just want to remind everyone watching and listening along that this is the Camera Life podcast, proudly brought to you by Lucky Straps. If you're looking for a fine handcrafted leather camera strap to grace your film, digital whatever camera you got, head to Luckystraps.com and if you want a little cheeky discount, put in code Greg G R E G and you'll get yourself a nice little discount on any of the Lucky Straps branded products. But also, if you are new to the channel, jump in the chat, let us know who you are, where you're from, what you shoot, what do you shoot with, and if you've got any questions for Rodney or any of us for that matter, please make sure you let us know. We love interacting with our audience. That's why we go live. That and the fact that we're too lazy to edit videos later. But the real reason, that's the real reason. But we do love the live chat. This is why we do what we do, because we want to engage with you guys and give you a place to ask your questions and share your thoughts. Please make sure you like subscribe, hit the bell button and because we do this twice a week at the moment, might even go to more. Maybe we'll have to do a third show. [01:25:25] Speaker B: We might. We've got some ideas. We got some. I want to do a game show. I want to do a trivia game show. That's my dream. And get the live call ins happening. Speaking of the chat, Jason. Otherwise I still prefer to call him the original chat name of Jay Shanny. K1000. K1000. So you can't beat a Pentax. Yeah, you can. [01:25:46] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:25:49] Speaker B: The K1. The K1000 is an icon. And then we've also got. I don't know if this. If this guy's, like, throwing shade or being nice to you, Greg. I can't. Can't tell. But we'll read it anyway. Hoff on Smash. Good name. [01:26:01] Speaker C: Hoff. [01:26:02] Speaker B: That Greg guy. That Greg guy looks like he wrote a few manifestos in his day. [01:26:08] Speaker C: Maybe I have. [01:26:09] Speaker B: Maybe he has. I don't know. [01:26:10] Speaker C: Yeah, I've done some things. [01:26:13] Speaker A: Anyway, you'll never know. [01:26:15] Speaker B: You'll never know until he publishes them. [01:26:17] Speaker C: The wizard of Pod. [01:26:22] Speaker B: Oh, no, that is good. [01:26:24] Speaker A: That's gonna stick. [01:26:26] Speaker D: That's definitely gonna stick. [01:26:27] Speaker C: That is gonna stick to Roman. Roman. I'm always Californian. Dreaming, mate. I'd love to do a. A coast surfing safari there. I love Malibu Point and Trestles and all those beautiful places. And Yosemite. I'd love to go to Yosemite National Park. Good old Ansel Adams material. So I got. [01:26:50] Speaker B: I got to go there, Rodney. I got to go there last year. It is. First of all, my photos look terrible. But we were, you know, swanning around in the middle of the day, just. It is jaw dropping, like it looks fake. Even when you're walking through it, it looks fake. It's. It's insane. There's no way to describe it. The photos you take don't do it justice unless you. I think if you went there. I didn't go there on a photo trip. I just went there exploring and took my camera. If you could. If you could get around for a few days and chase the light, you'd get some amazing photos. But just walking through there, the scale of those rocks, you cannot describe it until you do. Until you walk through there. Amazing place as rock. [01:27:37] Speaker C: And the August is a bit like that, too. I would imagine that. They're just awesome. It's awestrucking, you know, to. To be there and see it and feel it. And you know that waterfall there, that's. That's, you know, miles up, that's so, so tall, you know, and the sand, you know, But I'll answer them. I mean, Ansel Adams was a magician at black and white and black and white. If you're going to shoot landscape color, you need light. Light has got to be right. Black and white. You've got to know what you're doing. Totally. [01:28:10] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:28:12] Speaker C: I'll throw a curveball in here. When I. When I was a young printer, I did. Oh, see, I Went to Geelong Camera Club in the early 70s too. And. And I loved my time at the Geelong Camera Club and then I sort of grew out of it, I guess because I was young and silly. But we had a minister there, Jim Ian Littler, who, Who used to do boudoir photography and I loved his work. [01:28:38] Speaker A: But he was a minister. [01:28:39] Speaker C: He was a minister, yeah. What. [01:28:44] Speaker D: A religious minister? [01:28:45] Speaker C: Yeah. Or. [01:28:46] Speaker B: Or prime minister. [01:28:48] Speaker A: You can imagine a prime minister. [01:28:50] Speaker C: There was a few prime ministers at Geelong Camera Club when I, When I left there. When I left there, I, I mean, a few years later I, I started to do a circuit of judging and talks, which I love doing too. So that's something else. I've done school photography. I went. I did school photography at msp, which was opposition to Mark's company, Arthur Reed. Msp, MSP were big, but they were a Queensland owned sort of conglomerate. But if you ever done school photography, that is something else. But teaches you how to deal with speed though, like, wow, you know. [01:29:31] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:29:32] Speaker A: Jenna Burn. [01:29:33] Speaker C: And you gotta have a sense of humor. [01:29:36] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:29:37] Speaker C: And a fast eye. All the kids doing different things at you. [01:29:41] Speaker D: Patience as well, I think. [01:29:42] Speaker C: Patience, absolutely. Yeah. [01:29:44] Speaker D: Yeah. Sit through that long of the same monotonous kind of work, but teaches you something as well. So. [01:29:52] Speaker C: And, and Yashani, is it Yashani, who said something about Pentex? [01:29:57] Speaker B: Yes, hang on. Yes, he did. And he's. [01:29:59] Speaker C: I'd shoot with a K1000 today, anytime. Again, I've got a series of K12s and you know, as much as I love them, there's lots of great features, but they're not as good as Canon, you know, but, you know, they're a bit slow off the mark, I find. So. Yeah, I don't know. [01:30:21] Speaker A: We had a question in the chat a little earlier. Someone was wondering what you shoot with today. I think it was Nev. Nev Clark asked, what. What do you shoot with now? [01:30:34] Speaker C: K1s. K1. I got two K1s and a K12 top of the range Pentex. That's a 15.32.8. On the other one I've got a 7202.8 and I've got. What is it, 200 to 450 or 150 to 453.5. Why have I got three of them? Because I nearly give up photography in. In 2006 when digital hit. So I thought, don't like digital. I'm not going that way. [01:31:11] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:31:11] Speaker C: And a wedding photographer friend of mine said, take my nick on home. Use it on the weekend and tell me what you think on Monday. Well, I just, I enjoyed it and I thought, no, I'm a photographer, I love shooting, so I just had to embrace it. But after that I. I probably had a couple of digital pentexes, but I've got a Canon. What is, what's the cannon that shot the block? Oh, Mark. Mark 4 or what is it? Yeah, 5D. Yeah, yeah, I got that with a water housing. But why I. Why I have three and three lenses is because I don't like change. I don't trust changing ledges lenses on digital. I mean, the K1000, I could take the lens off and hose it out, but this, I go. [01:32:09] Speaker A: Especially around salty water. [01:32:11] Speaker B: Yeah, I've tried hosing out the digitals. They go, all right, just gotta dry him out the next day. [01:32:19] Speaker D: Mark III. [01:32:20] Speaker C: 5D3. Good on you. Lucinda. [01:32:22] Speaker B: Yeah, she knows a kid, she was sure. [01:32:27] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. [01:32:27] Speaker B: Right. Okay. So the Pentax K1 Mark II, I was just. I. I don't know a lot about the K1s. I was just googling it then. And then there's. Apparently there's been for more than a year or longer. There's rumors of a K1 Mark III. Yeah, I don't know whether that's, that's actually happening or not, but, yeah, not to my knowledge. [01:32:48] Speaker A: K ones are hugely popular in Japan. [01:32:50] Speaker B: Are they? [01:32:51] Speaker A: Yeah, people are sticking with them. [01:32:53] Speaker B: Interesting. [01:32:54] Speaker C: Yeah, there's a lot of, A lot of Pentech shooters out there, you know, but I think, I think they're embarrassed to say that I'm a Pentex shooter. [01:33:04] Speaker B: Yeah. Interesting, because it's like they, they were the ones that released the. Was the K1 Mark 2 with monochrome. Didn't they release a monochrome version? [01:33:15] Speaker C: Yeah. [01:33:15] Speaker B: Did that tempt you at all? Given that you're a bit of a fan of black and white, did that tempt you in any way? [01:33:22] Speaker C: No, because like, you know, now what you can do even with your phone, you can, you know, turn a color picture on your phone into a bloody good black and white. Why? So I went back to school a couple of years ago. I went to Oxygen where Lucinda was teaching. Not that I got to be taught by her, but I got a couple of secret little insights to, you know, computer. I went back because I'm a computer slouch, so. But, you know, I found Photoshop. I started what I call painting with light. I was having great time. A great time. You know, we have. We'd have a brief and what I actually wanted to print a couple of them to show you, but I didn't get around to it. But we had a brief of go out and shoot architecture or choose something. A brief. And then we work through different stages and I chose old and new architecture. So I spent, I spent a day in Geelong fusing old with new. And that was good. I got some great stuff. It was good to actually have a task, a mission to actually work on. And then we had to then expand it into Photoshop. [01:34:35] Speaker B: Wow. [01:34:36] Speaker C: And you know, both instructors come over to my computer and went, oh, check out what Rodney's doing. This is bloody art. And it was. But all I was doing was playing with color and light. But you know, you could really stuff it up as well. But yeah, these will look. These just. I don't know, I just had a feel for it. So I mean, you know, black and white. Well, yeah, I, I know what you're saying, but I don't even muck around with black and white in any form. Hand coloring. You know, I hand colored a few of those raw shots that I did. I hand colored them. But I love doing that. But I've never, I've never. People know me as a purist. And it's not that I stick to my guns about being a purist. I find that I'm out there that much that I get the right light. [01:35:31] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:35:31] Speaker C: So I don't have to tweak my images. I judged a few internationals and I can remember looking at one judge, fellow judge going, oh my God, you know this. Some of these images were just tweaked up to buggery and so you could tell that they weren't real, you know, but if you, if you've got to do that, I mean, there's a lot of photographers that are so good at just minutely tweaking them and I love that I take my hat off to that. It's no more different as. As anyone will point out to you, as in the dark room, dodging and burning. You know, it's just a, A more advanced degree of, of workmanship, you know. Yeah, yeah, sorry. [01:36:14] Speaker A: It's just a different way of handling the process, isn't it? [01:36:17] Speaker C: Yeah, and it's. And it's good. And I mean, it's great that there's a big resurgence back to film. It's fantastic. You know, when I'm at. Yeah. I still do markets and I have a lot of kids come up to me that are film photographers at the market because half my boxes of package stuff are film photos and half a Digital and, and they just love it, you know. And so we get to talk about old cameras and old film days and, you know. Yeah. [01:36:45] Speaker D: And are you still selling much at the markets these days? [01:36:48] Speaker C: Yeah, look, it's more a love thing for me now, Justin. You know, some days I'll have a good day, some days I'll do nothing. It's social. I see everybody in the town that I don't normally see for a year. Yeah, yeah, that's a bit of fun, you know. Yeah. I'm glad I'm not trying to sell hardcore now and make a big living out of it because it's a tough market out there, you know, with the cost of materials or paying someone else to do it, you really need to have your own setup. And then, you know, a friend of mine who does a lot of my mat cunning, he goes, bloody hell. You know the price of matte board now, Rod, you know when you used to pay 12 bucks a sheet, you know, it's 30 bucks a sheet or, you know. [01:37:35] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:37:35] Speaker C: So I mean, you know, I do, that's why I just do that sort of thing now. You know, I just mount it, foam core it and package it and sell it that way then you can take it away and frame it yourself. [01:37:50] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:37:51] Speaker C: You know, then I'm not paying for glass and, and all that and then letting them sit or pack in my car and until next market and. Yeah, but you know, like, it's still a good tourist market so, you know, nice sun city things still sell well, you know, kids jumping off the wall on big sea days. [01:38:18] Speaker D: That's cool. [01:38:20] Speaker C: So there's still that sort of market available. Yeah, yeah. And funny, you know, a lot, I, I, I don't know why a lot more people don't do markets, but. Because it's a good way to, you know, pop a few bucks in your pocket if you, if need be. [01:38:38] Speaker A: Yeah. It is interesting, isn't it, because we've spoken to a number of guests, I think M. Boynton comes to mind. She talked about how when she was in the top end, when working as a teacher, she was also doing photography in her spare time and, and to, you know, because she was in such a remote place where there weren't a lot of photographers, she was not only selling her work at markets to, you know, to start to generate some income from her work, but she was also entering a lot of competitions to get feedback about her work. But I think, you know, a lot of photographers have started off selling their prints in a market space and I think there's something really humble about that something and it's a, it's a very Australian, you know, we, a lot of the markets are dying out, but it is a very Australian thing that, you know, to have a Sunday market both in the city and in regional places. So Rodney, you, last year you celebrated your 50th year as a photographer. Talk to us about that, about that process for you. What was, what did that mean to you? What was it like for you to, to actually stop and go, oh, it's been 50 years. Like what does that mean for someone like yourself? [01:39:54] Speaker C: Oh, it was a bit of a shock. I went, oh, you know, like I've got to do something, you know, I've got to do something to celebrate it or otherwise it will just disappear. You can't have a 51st retrospective. And you know, and you know, lots of things come into play like how am I going to do this? Do I want to take that risk? Because I know with markets, you know, top end stuff's not selling that well. I know a lot of photographers that sell online and that and they, you know, I don't know if they're making a good living out of it, but you've got to be able to sell for a thousand plus to make a, a good living out of it. And with phones and everything like that, you know, you can print, you know, you can go and print yourself a good 20 by 30 inch canvas or print off a phone nowadays. So. But you know, yeah, lots of things come into play, Greg. It was just like, well boy, how am I going to do this? And what am I going to do? And, and, and how much money am I going to chuck at it in this economic climate? Am I willing to take the punt like I used to? Because my. I've got this wonderful building in Cornskill which is the Fisherman's Pavilion. So it's a big long rectangle with a Jarrah floor and just post and stud walls and weather boards on the outside. It's where I always had my Queenscliff shows and you know, I dress it up with a cray pot and fishing nets, cray pots that were given to me by old Harry who's a legendary cray fisherman from the Rip. You know, stuff from Lewis, all those old guys and they were there for my first time and Tide Won't Let a Sailor Sleep exhibition. So it's symbolic for me to go there and I've had probably 15 shows there every summer. So getting that, there was a little bit of something going on with that. So it was a bit of a struggle to get that. I applied for a, an events grant and I didn't get that and I went, you how you're not giving me a two thousand dollar grant when I've only been photographing here for fifty friggin years, you know. [01:42:09] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:42:10] Speaker C: And last year I was awarded Citizen of the year and I'm going because I'm citizen in the Year. You spoiled me too much, you know what I mean? [01:42:18] Speaker A: So yeah. [01:42:19] Speaker C: But anyway I managed to get it and that was good. And lo and behold I really had to make, I reckon I made 10 pieces for the whole show and it had easy 120, 130 pieces in the show and I, I found them all stored away in bubble wrap in my, in my gallery. Not in my gallery, in my two art rooms. [01:42:44] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:42:44] Speaker C: So I had a hundred and plus of limited editions from all sorts of decades. I was finding them in the op shop. A friend sent me a photo of one which was the title piece of the title piece of that same show back in 1997. Shot in 97 6. So that was in the op shop for 40 bucks and because I knew the woman that was there and she said oh no Rodney, you can have it, that's your photograph. So I'm donating a whole lot of books to them. But so the title, the title shot from 1997 become the title of my 50th retrospective. [01:43:36] Speaker A: Yep. [01:43:37] Speaker C: Oh, that's long time exposure on film. So I was experimenting. That ship's going in and out, squid boats on the horizon and the star trail. [01:43:49] Speaker A: Yeah, I can see it. Yeah, for sure. [01:43:53] Speaker C: So very cool. 1997. I don't know how many years ago. That is a fair few years ago. So you know, like the universe works in mysterious ways. Here I am rabbiting through stockpiles of photos going oh that's going in, that's going in. That's a ripper. So if you go onto my Insta site, one of the guys that has a local site down here, he'd come in on the last day and he just did a video, a walk around video. He went a little bit too quickly. But you can see the whole show and the layout. You know, I mean normally I would exhibit in straight line, nice uniform, straight line, all level, perfect. But you know, I kept finding things so I bloody just kept banging them in. They were, they were everywhere higgledy piggledy. But it was funny, it was a great exercise because I took to cover my butt, I took a whole lot of matted stuff In. I thought, righty, I'll cover my cost. We're selling package stuff. And what was I going to say then? Oh, I, I had, I had someone cutting all their mats for me and they cut them the wrong size. So I'm just about to open the exhibition and I realize that I've got to make 40 of these and they're all wrong. So I'm stressing out. Debugger. And I'm sweating. It's hot in the pavilion. And I rang my son, I said, I need your help, I need your help. You've got to come and help me hang. So he rocked up and it was just like a wonderful thing to do with him. I took a photo of him and I together and it was like. It kicked me back into gear having him there with me to do it. And he said, well, how do you normally do? And I said, well, you go put a hot shot there, a hot shot there, a hot shot there, and then we'll work around. And all of a sudden the two of us are banging them in. Bang, bang, bang, bang. And I went, wow, that is magic, mate. Thank you. You help. You just got it together with me and yeah, you know, it was, it was. It's how to build a show. It's a bit of a song, not a science, but there's, you know, if you. For anyone out there that's going to have a first show, I mean, a lot of galleries will hang it for you, but I like to hang my shows because it can be rhythmic, it can be timeline, it can be powerful and not so powerful, but if you're walking along, you go, wow, that is amazing. And that one's not so that one then. Oh, wow. You know what I mean? [01:46:23] Speaker B: It's. [01:46:24] Speaker C: Takes you through, it's. [01:46:26] Speaker B: I love it. And peaks and valleys and all that sort of stuff. As far as, yeah, taking people on. [01:46:33] Speaker C: A journey, I take them on a journey and everything's not as mind blowing. You know, Justin, if, if you could have 100 shot show of just magic masterpieces that blew people's mind, I think you're doing really, really well. Yeah, yeah, you know, I'd like to have a crack at that, but, you know, I might not either. [01:46:53] Speaker B: I'm just going to do a little bit of interpretation for our international listeners and then I'll also go to a couple of comments because there's been a heap of comments rolling in. The first interpretation I just wanted to check in with was stressing out to buggery. That just means quite stressed in case you're not familiar with the term? All right, few comments. [01:47:20] Speaker A: Yeah, don't Google buggery if you're at work. [01:47:23] Speaker B: No, no, no, no, no. You don't have to Google that. Well, we can explain it for you. [01:47:26] Speaker A: Yeah, do it at home later. [01:47:29] Speaker B: We've got Andre in the chat. Says North. North Shore, Oahu is where you want to be if you want to surf and probably surf photos. You ever been to Hawaii, Rodney? [01:47:39] Speaker C: No, I haven't been to Hawaii. I know. [01:47:45] Speaker B: From photos. [01:47:46] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Surfing magazines and just the circuit, you know. [01:47:50] Speaker A: Yep, yep. [01:47:54] Speaker B: Oh, sorry. I was just going to say Andre says I'm new. Hi, I'm new here. Welcome. Good to have you. And I'm shooting Nikon zf with a Voigtlander 50 F1. I assume that is the. The actual F1. And you didn't mean like F 1.4 or something? That'd be. [01:48:09] Speaker C: Yeah, probably. [01:48:10] Speaker B: That'd be a pretty fun little combo. [01:48:12] Speaker C: Yeah. Yeah. [01:48:16] Speaker B: Who else do we have in here? So the guys corrected me before. It wasn't when we're talking about the K, because I remember Pentax brought out that monochrome camera and I was trying to think. I was like, I'm sure it would have made a bigger splash if it was a full frame like the black and white version of the K1. But no, Jay Shannon corrected me. APSC sensor was the K3 monochrome. Oh, yeah, yeah. And that's why I didn't make probably as big as splash in the scene. But just being the APS C sensor. But it's still. I think it was still pretty popular. [01:48:49] Speaker C: I remember reading a little bit about it because I thought, oh, you guys are such tech heads. I went on. I went on a Pentex bloody podcast, or not a podcaster, you know, and I'm going, jeez, I didn't know my K1 did that. So I learned a hell of a lot about my own camera. I. I treat my k's like a K1000. You know what I mean? And yeah, I'll. I'll shoot a frame and use it like a bloody Polaroid and then I'll work from there. And that's the exposures perfect. Which they are pretty good at it. They are. They're bloody good cameras. And they've got so many hundred bloody seals. Waterproof seals in the. The K1s. I've had mine drowned a few times out on the end of the pier when the bombies broke over the pier and you had to get up underneath the roof or you get washed off the pier and you try and protect them by turning your back but you still get them wet. It's. It's exciting, exciting. Standing on the end of the pier with a wide angle watching this swell come at you and you go it's gonna keep coming and then all of a sudden it's still really coming and then bang. And you've just got to go. You know I've been completely back drenched many times so. Yeah. All part of the excitement of photography, isn't it? I guess. [01:50:12] Speaker A: Yeah, I think so. [01:50:13] Speaker B: As long as you're careful. Just be careful. Just remember everyone, Rodney is a professional because a heap of people got washed away recently in Australia on frocks mostly. Fishing. [01:50:26] Speaker A: Yeah, it happens a lot. [01:50:27] Speaker C: Yeah. Yeah. Never underestimate the sea and never turn your back on the sea they say. [01:50:32] Speaker B: Unless you're protecting a K1 and another one from. From Jay Shanny says it's not a coincidence that you too recently landscape guests shoot with Pentax K1s. Me thinks incredible weather ceiling and great sensor for dynamic range. [01:50:51] Speaker C: Yeah. [01:50:53] Speaker B: Also Roman, he might be gone now. He said thanks guys, really appreciate the break from the grind being able to watch this session. Rodney, you've inspired me to grab my GFX and go out tonight and shoot a few shots. Thanks guys. Well, it's great to have you Roman. We'll see you next time. [01:51:08] Speaker A: I feel like we're on the day if we've inspired someone to get out and exactly have a. Have a crack. [01:51:12] Speaker C: Absolutely. [01:51:13] Speaker D: You're just happy it's a Fuji Greg. [01:51:16] Speaker C: Yeah, I am. [01:51:16] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:51:18] Speaker A: Tickled my fancy. [01:51:20] Speaker B: What else do we have in here? Nev had a couple of good comments about when you first start editing everyone's a butcher and then when you finally work it out you're a chef, you probably do. You probably do go a bit heavy handed once you start learning editing techniques and then you learn that less is more and more maybe your photos get better. But he did ask. I don't know if you guys have used the enhancement feature in Lightroom the digital upscaling I assume he's talking about but oh my gosh. I printed some DJI mini 3 drone photos the other day up to 1 meter by 600 millimeters and came out pin sharp from a 12 megapixel sensor. That's pretty cool. [01:52:00] Speaker D: Haven't tried it but probably could have. [01:52:04] Speaker B: Yeah that's very cool. I. I think I've tried it but I didn't need it. I think I was just testing it and it's hard to tell. I mean obviously it upscales it, but I think until you need to do it with a small file and then print it, you're probably not going to see the magic. I think I was, I did a. [01:52:17] Speaker A: Review a couple years ago for Gigapixel AI. It's a type product, similar kind of concept, but I mean that was a, that was probably two or three years ago and I was upscaling iPhone photos and that was an older iPhone and yeah, it was quite, quite impressive what it could do. [01:52:36] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, very cool. We live in a magical time. Speaking of which, I've actually, I've had some questions written down this whole time for Rodney and I. I want to get to them. Unless you guys have anything that you. [01:52:49] Speaker D: Burning to ask you, jump in. [01:52:51] Speaker B: Okay. [01:52:52] Speaker C: Justin, can I just say something? [01:52:54] Speaker B: Absolutely. It's your show. [01:52:56] Speaker C: Yeah. Because I'm not. I haven't been responding to everybody that's been messaging you, but yeah, great, great for everyone to visit. The show is great. I love it. I really enjoy watching him. So thanks to all those that have commented and on my little show as well. So I appreciate that. Sort of don't know what you're doing on this side, you know. But yeah, that's good to have everyone contributed. So it's great. [01:53:22] Speaker A: Yeah, that's why we go live, mate. We just, we want people to be involved. [01:53:25] Speaker B: Yeah. AB feels more like a two way street instead of a one way street. That's much. [01:53:30] Speaker C: Yeah, it's a little family. [01:53:33] Speaker B: Exactly. [01:53:33] Speaker A: Absolutely. [01:53:34] Speaker B: And it's growing fast. It's growing fast. And if you. Yeah. Our last week or two weeks has been the biggest by far in the podcast history. Lots of new subscribers. So if you haven't subscribed yet, please help us out. Jump on there. [01:53:46] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:53:46] Speaker B: And, and subscribe. Yeah, we'd love you for it. Now I have a few burning questions. I don't know where to start. I'm gonna start here. So you've been shooting for 50 years and lots has changed, particularly obviously with camera technology and how it's distributed has changed hugely from the point of, of you've literally seen it go from having slide nights to just being dominated by social media for how share and digest photos. What hasn't changed in the 50 years that you've been part of the photographic world. What hasn't changed in photography? [01:54:36] Speaker C: Well, it's esoteric, it's. For me it's like composition and the quality of light has not changed. It's always been a major. No matter what you, what you're doing or what you're shooting on. That's just my own interpretation. I mean, you know, technology is amazing, but you know, I've got a semi state of the art camera and I've got to work on K1000 and they're both can produce equally beautiful color and then of course it's up to you to create composition. So really the mindset of how you, how you see should not have changed or hasn't changed. You know, I, I don't, I don't. I think you just go along on that plane. It's like, oh, you know, I could maybe relate it to surfboards. In the old days when we make surfboards, they were a little bit, bit stiff and stayed. But you actually worked with the wave more. Nowadays you do aerial ballet on with the boards that, you know, they're making now. So yeah, yeah, maybe, maybe I'd see the change. See, I haven't changed. I'm, I'm 50 years into it. So I, as I said you before, I still shoot with the K1000 mindset, except I've got all these other things that I've got to learn. That's why I went back to oxygen college a couple of years ago because I, I arrived at the door and Michael, Michael Chambers electorate, he said, what the are you doing here? And I said, oh mate, you'll understand what I'm doing here in the first week. But you know, I, I had a 2000 when I opened my second gallery. I got a Mac, one of them lime green, see through domed computers. [01:56:29] Speaker B: Nice. Oh yeah, they're beautiful. [01:56:32] Speaker C: I still had it. I turn it into a fishbowl. But yeah, like, you know, I learned, I learned a lot from a friend. But when I didn't have the friend around, I'm going, what, what do I do now? You know, like I went, no, I'd rather be shooting. I'm not sitting here. I mean, I'm not really good with learning. That's why I had to go back to school to learn, you know, to actually lock in and get the strap if. And Michael gave me the strap a few times. But I was a good, I was a good pupil on other extremes. You know, I helped all the new shooters. Like it was certificate three, so a lot of them had not really done much photography. So I was trading off my photography secrets to get some computer help. So it, it was a great class. It was a mixed bag. [01:57:20] Speaker B: Yeah, that's fun. [01:57:21] Speaker C: Yeah. [01:57:25] Speaker B: It did. Yeah, it did, absolutely. That's exactly what I wanted to highlight because there's Not a lot of people around that have participated in photography at the level you have for 50 years. And it's just, it is super interesting. I think we, we often get caught up and especially on this show because it's, it's fun. We love chatting about gear and stuff and the latest, but there are some things that just do not change and it was good to highlight that. But what I want to follow on from this might be a tricky question for you to answer. What about the future? And I know you're not, you know, you say you don't keep right up with the cutting edge of technology, but can you see it all, where things might be heading from here with photography in any facet you want, whether you want to talk about gear or how we share and appreciate photos and what might happen in the future. What do you think? Where are we going? [01:58:21] Speaker C: Ah, you know, I, I, you know I'd really liked, I mean it's sort of not getting lazy but I mean being able to point the camera and get exactly what you're seeing. Like, I mean, you know I founded the, co founded the Coinscape Music Festival. So I've shot that festival for 26 years and you know, I still struggle a little bit. Lucinda's amazing because she's got this incredible preset knowledge, computer knowledge. So you know, I've got to work a lot harder to get that. But you know, like I'd like to be able to just push the button and get exactly what I'm seeing. Cut out the think material, cut out everything else because I'm already composing in the head now. You know, like composition is something I pride myself on. I was saying, just talking to someone the other day and I go, you know, I live in a, a celluloid world. I'm not a celluloid world, Will. I could be talking down the street and I'll see a photograph and I'll crop it or you know, it's already composed. That's what happens with many years of shooting. So and I love that because it doesn't upset me that I'm seeing, my life is seeing, but my life does everything normal but abnormally as a photographer I'll hone into something, then I'll go, oh, I'm going to get the camera and photograph that. Cuz it's like beam me in Scotty. Wherever you go, you're seeing stuff, you know. Yeah, sometimes I have to go, bye bye. Good shot. I haven't got my phone or. But normally you have your phone now so you will get that Shot. So, yeah, I, I'd. Greg, what you shoot with a camera that just. What's it called where you actually just get what you see now, you know, you're. [02:00:21] Speaker A: It's called a Fujifilm. They, they are the best camera the. [02:00:23] Speaker C: Market and go to Fuji. [02:00:27] Speaker B: Yeah, don't listen to Greg, don't listen to. So you mean, you mean mirrorless, Rodney, in terms of mirrorless. Sorry, yeah, yeah, in the viewfinder, exactly what you're seeing, that's the photo that's about to be taken. [02:00:41] Speaker C: Yeah, but in the same vein, you know, I don't mind what I've got. I, I need to actually spend more or give more time to technology. You know, most photographers are so switched on, technology wise. Where I go, oh God, where I've come from, you know, there was no technology or not no technology. But yeah, yeah, yeah, you know, I just like to. I'm not going to go out of this world without, you know, really having a good crack at technology. But it keeps moving so bloody quick, quick. It's not funny, you know, and I guess that, I mean, it's weird, isn't it? Because we're going to two extremes. In the old days there weren't many photographers because people were scared of a camera because what the hell do you do with it? I mean, still I hear people go, what's the aperture doing? What's the shutter speed doing? What's the ISO? And you know, they are fundamentals of what you work with when you're a young photographer with manual cameras, you know, and that's still out there, you know, now we've got technology where you point your phone, people are making great prints out of their phone. So, yeah, you know, I could take a store to the market and just sell phone photos. Can you believe that? I've printed a few canvases 20 by 30 inch that are off my phone and they're mint. I don't even bother telling people unless I go, look, you could do that, you know, go. And you, you know, get on with your phone because, oh no, I couldn't do that. I mean, the amount of times in my life people said, oh, I couldn't do that. I said, you go and have a crack. Or someone showed me their photos. I go, that is really good. You should pursue it a bit harder. That is a great image. You know, people get. In the old days, people, we were sort of like masters because we really did a degree or we learned, had to learn how to expose, compose, do the whole box and dice, you know. [02:02:45] Speaker A: Yeah, much st. Learning. [02:02:48] Speaker C: Yeah. People looked at you like a craftsman, a tradesman, a. Yeah, yeah, yeah. [02:02:53] Speaker A: Now, yeah, it was, it was almost like a trade, was like an apprenticeship when you were learning. And then, you know, once you, once you hit your stride and you started doing work for money, it was like you had become a master craft person. [02:03:04] Speaker C: Yeah. [02:03:05] Speaker A: Back in the day. So it's, it's an interesting. Now anyone can be a photographer. Anyone can report or send their images to, you know, the news outlets if they were there at the time. You know, photojournalists aren't running around as rampantly as they used to because before a photo journalist can arrive on site to capture something, you know, 100 people have sent in images from their phone. It's already all over social media. Yeah, he's broke well before the news outlet got a chance to break it. So it's a very different world with, especially with smartphone photography. And, you know, it has a place. I think it'd be interesting to see where it, where it heads in the future. I know Justin's got some wacky ideas about what, what photography will look like in the future and devices and things like that, but, but I think it's okay. Yeah, we'll see. We'll see. [02:03:54] Speaker C: I, I, I enjoy it. It's, it's, it's, you know, that's why I really love this program because I'm, I'm sort of, you know, my ears prick up every show about something else that comes up, you know, and I go, wow, you know, I'm living in the dark ages, but I Probably am at 50 years in the body, in the game. But, and because I haven't, I'm passionate about the image. I'm not so passionate about the equipment, if you understand that. [02:04:20] Speaker B: Yep. [02:04:21] Speaker C: But, yeah, but I'm sort of why I went back to school, because I was driven to learn a little bit more and use it to, however I want to use it so, you know, not get totally left behind. But Jesus, it's moving fast. I mean, you know, Michael Chambers, the lecturer or St. Lucinda with her, the way that she does her music, photos, you know, I mean, she, she's incredible. And the stuff that Mick was showing us at, at Oxygen was amazing. And I'm going, wow. You know, boy, it's just endless. And it continues to be more endless. I mean, you know, I can see Justin's, you know, his thing pulses every week. You know, he's my wife and the giant brain, the pod wizard, lives in the old world a little bit, I reckon. [02:05:12] Speaker A: Yeah. I got A foot. I got a foot on each side of the border. [02:05:14] Speaker B: Yeah, he does. He flip flops. [02:05:17] Speaker C: Yeah. [02:05:17] Speaker B: Did you see I changed your name there, Greg? [02:05:21] Speaker C: Wizard of Pod. [02:05:22] Speaker A: Oh, nice. That's got to go. [02:05:26] Speaker B: Yeah, for a while. [02:05:28] Speaker C: I don't know Jim well enough. I mean, I've seen you other two guys, but it's JJ and the wizard of Pod now. [02:05:35] Speaker B: That's right. We're doing a full rebrand. [02:05:38] Speaker A: It's like a revival. [02:05:41] Speaker C: Did I answer that question, Justin? [02:05:42] Speaker B: I mean, absolutely. And I've got a follow up and then multiple more, so hopefully. Yeah, we're at two hours in, but there's just a couple more things I wanted to dig into before we let Rodney go. [02:05:55] Speaker C: So. [02:05:57] Speaker B: Following on from that, you sort of mentioned you want to pursue technology and learn a bit more still. What else? Is there anything else that you want it like? You've done so much, you've. You've had so many shows and exhibitions, you've shot so many a wide ranging subject and matter and documented life around where you live and, and further. What else would you like to achieve photographically? What, you know, what are the. What does the future hold for you personally in your work? [02:06:25] Speaker C: I've got to do books. I've got about five books that I would like to, you know, I'd like to go blink and they're done because they're in my mind. The image is there. It's a matter of putting it together. So, I mean, yeah, I'm pretty satisfied, but I mean, I'm a, I'm a photo junkie. I love taking photographs. You know, it's. It's my meditation, it's my connection, it's. And I'm addicted to writing too. I've been writing a journal since I was a teenager. I still write a four page a day. And you know, early days I would title all my photos and people love that. So I, I had to title them. I mean, it became a thing that I had to do. Now I find when I post on Insta, I'm writing little stories. [02:07:21] Speaker A: Yeah, I noticed that, yeah, they could. [02:07:24] Speaker C: Be hidden meanings, they could be how I'm feeling at the time. They could be. Be just an explosion of joy of that image or whatever. But I'm finding, you know, people are tapping into it, whether they understand or they think I'm a total nutter or whatever. But so writing, you know, so it's. Yeah, I could post every day on Insta or Facebook, but I try, you know, that's crazy doing that. It's sort of you know, but yeah. [02:07:53] Speaker B: Do you know. Do you know of the. The photographer, Alex Frain? [02:08:00] Speaker C: No. Frame or frame. [02:08:07] Speaker B: F, R A Y, N E from South Australia. This is his book. This is his book. It's a beautiful book. And what I was blown away by. And I feel like you could do something like this now. He's, he's published multiple books and he's done them through a publisher, and I'm sure that process is very difficult to get into. He might be a good person to chat to about how to go about it and, And I'm sure this was very expensive, but he said. I'm pretty sure it was him, that my mic is doing strange things. Can you guys hear that? [02:08:43] Speaker A: Yeah. Like you got a cross line. [02:08:45] Speaker B: Yeah, it's weird. Sorry. Sorry, everyone. I'll try and diagnose, but very quickly. [02:08:52] Speaker D: It's better. [02:08:54] Speaker B: He. He said that he handed over all of his images to a graphic designer and they put the book together for him and it's coming out stunningly fantastic. It's. It's a South Australian. Like, I don't even know how to explain what the book is, but it's. It's just like the publisher. No, no, no. The book is about South Australia. It's about it from so many different angles. [02:09:24] Speaker C: Yeah. [02:09:24] Speaker B: Shot it over a long time. And there's. [02:09:27] Speaker A: It's all on film too, isn't it? Isn't it, Alex? [02:09:29] Speaker B: No, no, no. He's film. IPhone, digital med. Medium format or. And. And it says each. What each image was taken with. Not. Not cameras and stuff, but it'll just say like 120 negative or, you know, digital or whatever. It's. It's a wonderful book and I, I really feel like your work could be done in a very similar way, particularly if you added some of those journal entries and things in there at relevant spots. [02:09:57] Speaker C: Yeah. [02:09:58] Speaker B: I don't know. I don't know if there's a way to. To pursue that, but I feel like Alex would be a great person to tap into, to chat to, to see, like, how you even get started in that journey. [02:10:09] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. No, it's. You know, I've often said, too often I said I'd like a year to just edit my whole collection. You know what I mean? And. And I mean, now digitally, it's a lot easier. I. I sort of set about to do a book back in 97, but you were shooting it on film as well, you know, and everything was a lot harder, like scanning, you know, your negs to put into a book and, you know, Maybe again everything happens for a reason. Maybe that'll be the last phase of my not, you know, my, not my career but you know, the next five years, maybe by the time I'm 70, I would put those books together. So yeah, and it's a lot easier because as you say, I could just pull stuff off my phone, da da da da da. And I mean, you know, formatting of, of pages is a lot easier and I'd never be a big text man. I mean, gee, you know, I went, I forget what year it was now. Back in late 90s 2000, I applied for Australian arts grant and I missed the boat again because at the time my good friend John Thwaites was dep. Acting premier and the grant was $100,000 grant to showcase Victoria Melbourne Victoria. And I just a year before that I applied or a couple of years before that I, I'd applied for a grant to do a book on the otways. I wanted to live for a year in the otway and produce a toffee, a coffee table book. Well, the Yellow Peril beat me to that grant. And look, you know the sculpture that was Living on the river. [02:11:46] Speaker A: Oh yes. [02:11:47] Speaker C: I just thought, you know, I'm glad that other lady, she's doing a book because I thought, you know, 98, 99, I, I was, I was harassing grants to, to get to do, to live down there and do that book because I was surfing in the otways back then myself, you know, Peterborough, Port Campbell, finding waterfalls and I thought, geez, you know, I look, I laughed the other week. I thought that book could have been still being reprinted and you probably would have upgraded a little bit. But just imagine living for a year in the otways, like, you know, adventuresome, going up streams and you know, rock climbing and, and just documenting all the stuff. You know, no one's done it since then. I mean I'm so glad some, I forget her name, but I'm so glad. Sam. Yeah, yeah, someone's doing something because. Yeah, and it is difficult. I, I banged on the door to get, I try to do a book in 97 when I was so yeah, I was, when I was taking that show around the bay, there's me arriving in Williamstown on my boat and like I took up a couple of photos with me on board and I come in the bay at Williamstown, I rang up the gallery customs wharf and I said, come to the back window and wave to me. And they said, what are you on? And they did. And there I was holding up a couple of photos for the exhibition. And I steamed all through the night in, in from Queenstaff to Williamstown in Port Phillip Bay. It was pretty scary and dark and. But, you know, I did crazy things like that back then. That was 90, 97, 98. I was a lot younger and stupid, but. But I took my boat because then I'll. Then I, I started working off my boat so I could go across to Port. Port Melbourne and Sandy and work on. On photos for the next show as it went from Bayside Beach. But yeah, that book that I had in mind, that is still in mind. I'm not gonna. I'm not gonna launch that out in the. In the media world because this is. This is sort of top secret. [02:13:58] Speaker A: Fair enough. [02:13:59] Speaker B: Fair enough. [02:14:01] Speaker A: Yeah. [02:14:02] Speaker C: And it might not happen, so you don't want to preempt stuff, but, you know, what mean? [02:14:05] Speaker A: I, I mean, yeah, I, I think it's a worthy goal to strive towards. And, you know, I think there's the other. The flip side of it is, you know, we. I, I've done photo books for my travels and I get a lot of joy from it. But I think, you know, from a historical point of view that there's almost. Maybe not an obligation, maybe that's not the right word or the right sentiment, but there's a. Maybe a necessity to publish images from the past so that there is a documentation of how the world used to be. Because, you know, my fear is that in the future, in years to come, people will look back and there'll be big gaps in our knowledge of what happened and how the world was now, because no one's printing, no one's. Everyone's just dumping everything onto the Internet and not putting any thought or narrative behind it. And I think that from a historian, a historical point of view, that there may be gaps, and I think photos help to fill some of those gaps. [02:15:04] Speaker C: Absolutely, yeah. [02:15:05] Speaker A: How are you going with your audio, Justin? [02:15:07] Speaker B: I've switched to the. I've switched to the speakers. Can you hear me? [02:15:11] Speaker A: It must be that Canon. Must be something to do with the Canon. [02:15:14] Speaker B: No, it'll be. It'll be the Roadcaster. I'll sort it out later. I do. I have one more. One more question, I think. Actually two more. But what, what advice would you have for someone getting started in photography now that, you know, maybe looks at the industry and thinks, oh, it's. It's all been done before, you know, it's. It's a saturated market now and all that kind of stuff? What advice could you give someone who wants to have a, you know, a 50 year career like you've had. [02:15:51] Speaker C: Ah, good question. Yeah. I mean, you've just, well, you know, really reverse the clock back for what I did. I just, you know, and I love Lucinda for that reason. Look, I've, I've got a photo, I don't know where to put my hands on it of her when she started at Queenscliff Music Festival with us just as a gorgeous young girl, you know, and she's just taken the bull by the horns and gone at it, you know, being determined, did what she wanted to do and didn't let anything get in the way. You know, I look back at my career and shake my head sometimes and go, you know, what was I thinking? But I wasn't thinking I wanted to do it, so I did it, you know. You know. Yeah, it's. I, I just say, you know, go for it, you know, just. But it's a lot more difficult. I mean, have a backup plan. You see. I was really fortunate that I did apprenticeship as a carpenter. I, I needed to keep money coming, so I worked in a kitchen. I worked in a kitchen primarily for the hours to make me available to shoot. So have a. You've got to have money, you know, you've, you've got to survive, you've got to eat, you've got to pay bills, you've got to buy equipment. Equipment, you got to do that. But you know, try everything, you know, I mean, I'm sure, sure there must be plenty of assisting jobs in studios around Melbourne. I must, I must have a look at that. Because when I went to decent exposure, There was about 20 of us working there, three directors, you know, about 10 shooters and 10 assistants and we were flat stick. But I don't know whether that industry now is still the same because, you know, they were working with Ms. And Hasselblads and, you know, what a great era, you know, champagne on set, buddy, wild dancing parties, you know, it was, it was just an am. I'm so, I mean, you know, so glad to, to have experienced that because, you know, I work with a guy called Mark Hancock and we spent 18 hours on one Kenworth shoot. Now he was just a lighting technician. He had lightings, lights every little lights everywhere and the, the print. The end result was just a bloody amazing, you know, but yeah, to answer that question, just be passionate and go for it and survive, you know, you've got to survive, but follow your passion, you know. I mean. Yeah, yeah, go for it, I reckon. [02:18:34] Speaker B: Perfect. [02:18:35] Speaker C: Learn as much as you can, you Know, learn as much. You got to learn as much as you can. I found the most prolific time or the best work I ever produced when I probably in my second gallery because I was so immersed in it. I never wore shoes. I had sand in my toes all the time. Time. Because I'd be on the beach at dawn, I'd be on Swan Bay, I'd be on my boat, I'd be in the gallery, the fire would be lit, the music would be on, it'd be a glass of wine at night, I'd be open. So, you know, and I was shooting and just free to shoot, no complications. It's very hard if you've got a, a real job and you're a photographer as well, you've got to, you know, you've gotta, you gotta chuck yourself right into it. I mean, and that's a scary thing to say now because it's a lot harder to make a living, right? [02:19:30] Speaker B: So, so you said, you said two kind of contradicting things there. One, you said, you need, you need money. You should have some sort of job so you can support yourself while you're trying to, to become a photographer. But then you also said to create the, you know, your best work, you had to chuck yourself deep into it and not have the, the job kind of holding you back. Is that, is there a point there where it changes from one to the other where you're like, okay, I've, I've, I've had a job to kind of keep me, keep me going, but at some point I've got to take a leap? [02:20:04] Speaker C: Yeah, well, I was, I was lucky that I, you know, what I was saying then is that I had a backup or not. I didn't even plan to have a back backup plan. When I was a kid, they wouldn't let me do art at school because I wasn't good at art. And later, years later at an exhibition, Mr. Steinford was having a wine at the bar. And I went up and said, how you going? And we talked about that, you know, and there I was doing really well with my photography. And I said, you wouldn't let me do art at secondary school. But, you know, all I was saying then is, you know, when I jumped ship on different jobs to pursue my photography, it was to give me time, but I needed money to, to do it as well. You know, in my second gallery even, I was shooting 10 rolls a week. That's 10, 36 rolls a week. That was 200 bucks that I had to pay before I paid rent or frame. Or glass or whatever. So, yeah, it is contradictory in one way, but if you're just starting out, then you've got to learn everything you can learn and be the best at at it as possible, I guess. [02:21:15] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. [02:21:16] Speaker C: And it's what scares people away from it, I guess, you know, or. Or go, you know. Look, a lot of people do school and I reckon a lot of people do school photography that love photography for that same reason, to keep fueling the fire, to keep the money in the bank, you know. You know, I love what Lucinda's doing. She's really jumped ship and going for it, whereas before she was teaching at Oxygen and also doing her music stuff. So, you know, it's frustrating because you want to do what you love, but you also got to pay the bills. [02:21:51] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. It's a tricky balance, isn't it? [02:21:53] Speaker C: Yeah. [02:21:54] Speaker B: And Nev Clark's in the. In the chat, former or a couple of previous guest appearances from Nev and he is having the same issue. He says, this is my constant dilemma. Do I make the leap? It's been on my mind so much. Holding down a day job and doing photography is bloody hard work. I know where he's coming from. [02:22:14] Speaker C: Absolutely. Nev. I, as I said, I was really fortunate because I didn't even think about it and I had the backup to do it. If I had just taken on photography and tried to survive, I don't know how I would have went. Probably that's why I opened my first gallery. I was passionate and I went, this is what I want to do. The second one was I was handing out lots of money in commission and as much as I love exhibiting and meeting people in the exposure, you know, that was a great move to put it into rent and base myself. So, yeah, yeah, you know, and I made a good living for, you know, six years and. And a great lifestyle, really, you know, living the dream, so to speak. But, oh, you know, there were times when I'm going, I've got rights for dinner this week, but I got no veggies to go with it, you know, it wasn't all Queensland was like summertime was bang, you know, three months, just bang. And then winter come and you could shoot a gun up the street. And it's still like that for poor old Queens Club. But you learn to squirrel away a bit for the rainy days. And, yeah, life's a bit of a juggle in it. I mean, what's the option working full time for. With some job that you don't like to have money for the Weekend. You know, I'm not gonna say go for it, Nev, but I know your dilemma. Yeah, yeah. [02:23:46] Speaker B: Final, final question ish from me anyway, because we are approaching two and a half hours. This is a marathon. I already know what the answer is going to be, but I'm going to ask you anyway. What's your. What's your zombie apocalypse camera? If you know, if it was the end of the world and you had to run off down the street, but document how things are going to unfold in the end of the world, what camera and lens do you grab? [02:24:16] Speaker C: I. I always try and answer this. When you ask this question myself, I go, which one will it be? And you know, I go to myself, well, I'm gonna die, aren't I? [02:24:32] Speaker D: Maybe not. [02:24:32] Speaker A: Probably. Maybe we all will eventually. But you know, if there's a way to go at the end of the world, zombie's going to be it. [02:24:39] Speaker C: So, you know, I thought to myself, well, I'm. I'm a sentimental old bastard. And because I started with this, I'm gonna end with this. And my mum would be very proud of me. And so when I'm being gobbled up and my spirit goes to heaven or I'm in the arms of my mum, I said, I did it your way, mom. So. Oh, I'll take them off. [02:25:02] Speaker A: I think that's one of the best answers we've had. [02:25:05] Speaker B: That's the first time the box brownie has been answered for. The zombie apocalypse camera. [02:25:10] Speaker C: Go Box brownie. It's a handy little projectile too. Once I shot the 10 frames, I just throw it at the bastards. [02:25:20] Speaker B: After you take the filmmaker. [02:25:22] Speaker C: After I took the feel. Yeah. [02:25:24] Speaker A: Yeah. [02:25:26] Speaker B: Well, that is very good. [02:25:27] Speaker A: That's a wonderful answer. [02:25:29] Speaker B: There isn't any. Is is there isn't anything else that you need to show us that you brought for show and tell from those cameras on? There's no other special cameras you got hiding there? Nothing fancy that we should see? [02:25:38] Speaker C: Oh no, I found lots of things. I. Thank you very much for inviting me. Get rabbiting through the back room. I found lots of things, but no. [02:25:49] Speaker D: I think to see that the waterfall photo on Uluru behind you. A bit closer. [02:25:55] Speaker B: You want to see it closer? [02:25:56] Speaker C: Yeah, closer. [02:25:58] Speaker D: I'd love to. It's beautiful. And I. I can't quite get it. The deep. Yeah. Maybe that is. Yeah. That's epic. [02:26:08] Speaker B: I had no idea that there was a waterfall like that. [02:26:12] Speaker C: Only when it rains. [02:26:13] Speaker A: Yeah. Cuz the top of the top of his rock, I've climbed it. I climbed it in high School. I don't think you're allowed to anymore. They banned that years ago. But the top of it is pitted with craters like these huge. Like what you see there, these huge carved out like, almost like an ice cream scoop carved out the rock. And they, when they have wet season, they just fill up and eventually they'll spill. [02:26:36] Speaker C: You would only be a little, little spec Greg, wouldn't you, on one of those sculptures. [02:26:41] Speaker A: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's huge. It's. It's quite formidable. And I think that, you know, it's, it's obviously it's really different to going to say into a national park like Yosemite. Not that I've been, but I've seen lots of images. Obviously we all have. But Ayers Rock is so profound in that it's in the middle of a desert. It just pops up out of nowhere. That and the Olgas and then in the distance they're in a row, there's a plateau. I can't remember the name of the plateau. Yeah, they just come out of nowhere. And I think that's what's so formidable and so enticing about, about Uluru is, is that, you know, it's, it's, it just stands there on its own. [02:27:22] Speaker C: Yeah. [02:27:23] Speaker A: You know, it's not surrounded by forest or other mountains. It just, it just. And it's huge. It's incredibly big. [02:27:31] Speaker C: But yeah. So anyway, I can still remember, you know, hitting the road and getting there and going, oh my God. You know, like, it's not. No photo does it justice. If you have a look at a photo, a photo of it with a sunny sky, which most of the time it is. All the black marks on the rock are where waterfalls are when it rains. So just imagine that because I walked right around photograph. I don't know how many waterfalls there were. And it fills up like a moat at the bottom. So at Maggie Springs and goes around. It's just phenomenal. And the noise of it is incredible because it fills up up top and then just cascades over. I'd love to have been got the first shot of it, you know, just coming over, being ready for it, you know, that first cascade. But that was one of the most awesome experiences and to have it on my own. I didn't have any other tourist or anyone else there. It was just. I had lots of aboriginal spirits with me. I know that that feeling was phenomenal. I kept look, feeling and looking, watching, going, well, hey, he loves what's going on, you know, Bloody got the clap. Sticks out. No, I, I Feel every time I think of it, I go, oh, you know, that was phenomenal. [02:29:00] Speaker A: That's awesome. [02:29:01] Speaker C: It's good when it's turquoise guys as well. It's magic then too, so. Yeah, but you're right, Greg. Like, you know, the old is another thing all together, you know, and then King's Canyon and they're all dotted in, in spots in the bloody desert. Yeah, but we're very lucky as photographs photographers in Australia. We have got the world's our oyster, you know. Yeah, very forest, you know, 12 apostles, deserts. Buddy. Yeah. [02:29:32] Speaker B: You're making me want to hit the road in the van. [02:29:34] Speaker C: Same, same. Let's go. [02:29:37] Speaker B: Road trip. [02:29:39] Speaker A: Yeah. Look, I think it might be time to wrap. [02:29:46] Speaker C: Yeah. [02:29:46] Speaker A: But before we do wrap up, just a couple of housekeeping things for anyone that's been watching along or listening on our audio podcasts. Obviously that'll be later, but plenty of people actually put this on, just audio in the background while they're doing other things. Please make sure you give us a, like, it helps us out a lot. It, it enables other people, it enables YouTube to, to think that this is worth sharing with other, other folk. And as we've already discussed, what we do is we do a live show because we want people to interact with us in the moment. We want people to talk to our guests, to, to, you know, to talk to us. So please make sure you like, subscribe, hit the notification button. We've also been putting out a shit ton of YouTube shorts and posts on social media, so make sure you're following us on all the appropriate channels. And also to thank our today's sponsor, which is Lucky straps. Head to Luckystraps.com if you're looking for a premium leather camera strap also boasting the Aussie made logo. And yeah, head to Luckystraps.com grab yourself a strap. Use code Greg G R E G for a healthy little discount. But with all that out of the way. Oh, one other thing, please don't forget to join us on Monday evening, 7:30pm we have Lucinda joining us, Lucinda Goodwin, Joel Elston and Jason Lau to talk about why we shoot film in the digital age. So that's going to be our first kind of panel podcast. And yeah, please make sure you join us for that. With all of that out of the way, I want to thank Rodney for what has been an amazing discussion, you know, inspirational, funny. I think there's, there's, there's been such a lovely kind of larrikin vibe from you, Rodney. That and for those of you watching from Overseas. If you're wondering what a larrikin is, Well, I think Rodney kind of exemplifies that in all the good ways, Rodney. In all the good ways. But. But look, thank. Yeah. Thank you so much, Rodney, for joining us on the Camera Life podcast. This has been such an incredible chat and we really value your time and. Yeah. And we wish you all the best with the photo books and, you know, maybe another couple of decades of amazing photography at the least. So thank you. [02:32:10] Speaker C: Pleasure. Thanks for having me, guys. I enjoy what you do and it's been an honor to be on your program. [02:32:15] Speaker B: Thank you very much. Thanks for the time. [02:32:17] Speaker C: Thanks for all the great work. [02:32:19] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. You're an inspiration to many, I'm sure. But look, on that note, everybody, we're going to say goodbye. This has been the Camera Live podcast. It is the. What is it today? It's like the 8th, 19th of June, and episode 90 is now done and dusted. We will see you Monday evening. [02:32:37] Speaker C: Thanks. [02:32:37] Speaker D: I'm creeping up to 100. [02:32:39] Speaker C: Yeah. [02:32:40] Speaker B: Oh, I gotta say. I gotta say goodbye to the chat. So Nev. Nev's been sick. He's at home watching the show live because he doesn't have to go to his day job. So that's. That's a good thing if you're sick. [02:32:49] Speaker A: Yeah. [02:32:50] Speaker B: Join us live if you're having a sicky. Andre says Brazil would be an amazing country to visit and photograph. It is beautiful. [02:32:59] Speaker A: Yeah. [02:32:59] Speaker B: Philip Johnson. [02:33:00] Speaker C: Absolutely. [02:33:02] Speaker B: Oh, you figured. No, I'm in there, too. Yeah. Thanks, Rodney. And a very fast thanks to the rest of the chat as we play the music. [02:33:11] Speaker A: Yep. [02:33:11] Speaker B: Is that playing? [02:33:13] Speaker A: Not yet. [02:33:14] Speaker C: Not yet. Keep snapping, everybody. Oh, we can't play music because I. [02:33:18] Speaker B: Don'T have my rodecaster working. So you guys will have to sing while I say no. [02:33:23] Speaker C: Nobody way. Thanks, Lucinda. [02:33:27] Speaker D: Thanks, everyone. [02:33:29] Speaker B: Rock says J. Best viewers. Thanks. [02:33:33] Speaker D: I think that's a bot. Justin. [02:33:35] Speaker B: I think that was a bot. [02:33:38] Speaker D: You know you've made it when the bots are now attacking us, so. [02:33:42] Speaker B: That's right. Thanks every. [02:33:44] Speaker C: Yeah, I'm learning. All right, gang, with my K1, get on your P.